Tim Walz says ‘we wouldn’t be in this mess’ if it wasn’t for him and Harris

Nope. This is on Biden. It's his fault Harris/Walz were put into an impossible situation.

That senile old fuck was supposed to be a one-term president. If they'd spent 4 years planning for 2024 instead of sitting around with their thumbs up their asses maybe they could have run a winning campaign.

But no, Joe was too proud or stupid or both to stick to that plan. This election was lost the instant he doddered his way on to the debate stage on 6/27/24.

It's on Biden and Garland for not throwing Trump in prison the second his term ended.
- Exactly, and it's the third time we've been betrayed like this.
  Not going after the Bush administration.
  Not going after the subprime mortgage architects.
  Not going after Trump.
  Three times, they've had the easiest of layups for public approval of all time and they've consistently fucked it up.
- Amen. 4 years to build a case? January 6th, spend 6-12 months and file charges. What the fuck were they doing for 4 years?
- Or at least the second the supreme court said whatever the president does is legal as long as it's an "official act".
- The Oligarchy will never convict one of their own. For four years, I said it was the dog and pony show. And in the end, nothing will happen to Trump. Here we are.
Lots and lots of balls were dropped. Garland didn't get Trump in jail when he could have. Biden didn't stick to only one term. A democratic candidate wasn't really elected when Biden stepped down (for the record, I think that Harris was more than qualified, but a lot of people were upset that she was just "chosen"). Harris didn't try to stand out and be her own candidate - she mostly just stuck with the status quo and never disagreed with Biden. Etc etc etc.
- Warning bells started going off in my head the moment that the Democrats announced that Harris was going to be the candidate after Biden dropped out, not because I thought she was an unqualified candidate but because there was no time taken to search for other candidates. Maybe it was too close to the election to take the time to go through the rigamarole of all that but I think even a cursory effort to do so would have gone a long way towards making it feel like people's opinions actually mattered. Biden dropping out was huge (at least to me) because it felt like an acknowledgement of the voters who had consistently felt like they were held hostage for their votes because the alternative was a fascist.
  It doesn't help either that they went on to repeatedly shoot themselves in the feet while chasing moderate Republican votes, getting other prominent Democrats to chastise certain classes of voters and breeding the same voter apathy that hurt them in 2016, and their refusal to acknowledge that what's happening in Gaza is a genocide that we shouldn't help Israel perpetrate.
- Garland never had any intention to prosecute trump
A cascade of failures. Beyond Joe not man enough GTFO, the DNC once again anointed a letter instead of letting the public decide. yes, Joe should never have run for a second term. Given that he did, he should have dropped out sooner. Given that he didn't, the DNC should have had an open convention rather than putting their thumbs on the scale in back room deals.
Tim is 100% right that we would not be in this mess if they had won, but when is the DNC going to stop trying to manipulate everything and lie to us about it? They are to blame as much as Repugnacans.
- Because they and R are same team. I bet it's like lawyers who viciously go after each other in court, them have golf and martinis on weekends.
Harris made choices. She could have chosen not to adopt every single one of Bidens policies. What was biden going to do, fire her? If you look back at her presidential run she really struggled to articulate any policies back then too.
- What was biden going to do, fire her
  If the reports are true, yes that seems to be the case. I'm not really sure what would have happened, but she was absolutely threatened into defending Biden's legacy.
Walz emphasized Democrats must offer something better, not just criticize Trump.
Biden shares a lot of the responsibility, but Harris and Walz were running on fundamentally faulty assumptions.
Biden made an appropriate decision to back out. He should have done it much sooner. But I'm not sure I would characterize the failings of Harris/Walz as Biden's fault. I don't really feel that's fair.
Harris' main draw was that she didn't want to do anything, which pissed off progressives. She was pro-establishment and pro-status quo. She didn't need Biden's help to not get votes... I have no love for Biden, but the truth is the truth.
- But I’m not sure I would characterize the failings of Harris/Walz as Biden’s fault.
  Inasmuch as they ran as a continuation of his policy, I'd say there's some blame to be had.
This is on anyone who was within arms reach of Trump in the last decade and didn't take matters into their own hands.
- Yeah a bunch of people want to make excuses for 90 million people who just... Didn't think it was important who won.
  Campaign was flawed but if people showed up to vote against fascism we wouldn't be here. And there's zero excuse for all 90 million of them to not show up.
  Edit- well, Im reading your post in a different light but, yes that too.

Turns out holding back the things that work (like calling fascists "weird") while not breaking with some of Biden's unpopular policies was a terrible idea... who would've thought? At least Walz is honest enough to admit it. I doubt the DNC will let the social democrats like Walz or Bernie take the lead though... establishment dems would rather stand by and praise Reagan while Trump dismantles the constitution.

- You can pretty much tell which one , Ds are getting the same megadonor moneys from the GOP, and yes the Dems are hoping coast on by along with the GOP, to eek some federal elections.
- he lost again because everyone tone deaf wanted Biden because they believed "well, he was around Obama during his two terms, he should be in because he'll just continue what Obama built!".
  An article I read about this talked about how DNC-funded advertising discredited Bernie not by attacking his actual policies, but via a message of "his promises are good, and you may like them, but how many voters out there won't vote for a scary socialist?". I think that's ultimately what did him in; it's impossible to make a reasonable person hate the stuff Bernie was promising (unless they think it's gonna placate the proletariat and make them lose the will to seize the means of production or some shit), but it is possible to convince them that some unspecified "many people" wouldn't vote for him and therefore he'd lose the election.
- I don't think Bernie will run again in 2028, but he is still relevant right now because nobody else is taking the lead. I hope people like Walz will step up and try to turn the DNC around. It'll be an uphill battle even with the DNC, not to speak of the actual election.
"Weird" alienated voters. It's an example of bad messaging that the dems doubled down on that made them lose.
They lacked a platform that promised anything but more of the same that Americans were tired of. They needed to present something new and hopeful, not just lob an insult that much of America identifies with. A suite of policies to help the working class attracts votes to your side. Calling your opponents weird attracts votes to the weird anti-establishment.
Weird plays into the republican's hands, and it annoys the hell out of me how the dems decided to throw the election to focus on petty insults that come off as compliments to most observers.
A part of the problem is that they didn't hold back on broken and alienating messaging like "weird". They should have focused on talking about what they can do for the people.
- No, weird was a successful offensive attack on Republicans that was both popular and was great at making them get flustered and double down on their weirdness (which is itself an incredibly charitable way to describe their fascist policies)
  https://www.vox.com/politics/365833/trump-harris-walz-weird-2024-election-voters-biden-poll-attack-messaging
  Other messaging that was very popular
  https://blueprint2024.com/polling/harris-poll-positive-message-8-8/
  https://blueprint-research.com/polling/distance-biden-ads-message-test-10-15/
- “Weird” alienated voters.
  Oh? got any proof of that? Was your proof on fox news maybe? I saw plenty of articles praising it.
- Alienated which voters?

I disagree Mr. Walz. Had Biden not sat on his hands after being given the power of god by the supreme court - we wouldn't be in this mess today.

You don't even need to go to the SCOTUS decision. Would have been enough for Biden to order his DOJ to immediately arrest and imprison Trump, in the same way that Trump is currently arresting and imprisoning American residents. We've done far worse to people suspected of espionage for far less.
- Exactly this!
Shit if Biden had engaged with the 25th amendment in good faith and we'd had President Harris for a year already it would have been totally different.
- Yep. There were several possible paths that kept America a democracy and put the orange traitor where he belonged - none of which Biden and company chose. Instead - they turned tail and ran - even in the face of overwhelming evidence of voter fraud and manipulation.

Not you walz but the Democratic party. Send out 19 billion to Israel while our kids were hungry in school.

Thank God Trump won, because now we get... checks notes... Mar-a-Gaza!?
- Like as if Biden did not find Israel. 19 billion dollar of our money As a Democrat, I expected Biden to do better. We already know trump is crap. One worse does not make another one good. Both parties are bad. United States is doomed with just two parties. I don't want any of these two parties. What's you take?
  If you want to win my vote and many others, know your base well democrats. We are not here to elect the least worse, we are here to elect the best out there for this nation. And don't come btching here because u guys literally are the one that said our vote does not count before the election. may be it suddenly does? See ya in 2028. Hope u learn some lesson.
- Thank god for your hindsight, without you we'd never realize what Trump is doing!
So true. The republicans are clearly better.
- Yeah yeah, continue giving excuses to the Democrats for not being as bad as the Republicans. They're lucky they have supporters like you who will just take whatever bullshit they give out whenever they try and emulate the Republicans. Clearly you're not satisfied with how right leaning the political system in America already is, you want them to go all the way. Considering how spineless their supporters are in making them shift their policies, I can see why they think it's completely fine for them to offer mediocrity in the face of fascism.
- So the answer is to keep slowly sliding into fascism with the 'slightly less evil' party, rather than forcing their hand in the hope of democratic reforms which stop the slide?
- Did I say it anywhere that Republicans are better?
Tim signed the bill that guaranteed free breakfast and lunch for every K-12 student in Minnesota public schools. No needs-testing, no "lunch debt"...just free healthy food for children.

“We wouldn’t be in this mess if we’d have won the election — and we didn’t,”
(Implies that if they(H&W) would have won we wouldn't be in this mess)

has quite the different sentiment than

"Tim Walz says ‘we wouldn’t be in this mess’ if it wasn’t for him and Harris" (Implies its their fault we are in this mess)

These headlines -_-

Not that I prefer straight bias but we got conservative media calling these people cutting all of everyone's safety nets "heroes" and this is supposed to be liberal media straight misquoting for clicks?

We are in the worst timeline.

I do blame them, though. They could have ridden the coattails of Biden's withdrawal all the way to victory, but instead Hartis capitulated and palled around on stages with Republicans instead of Walz.
The failure of the Democrat campaign has a lot of causes, but none more so than the failure of leadership.
Walz emphasized Democrats must offer something better, not just criticize Trump.
From the article:
"We have to make sure that Americans know it’s not just that Donald Trump is bad but we’re offering them something better," he continued. "And I think that’s what we need to work on."
That's an admission of culpability.

There's no leadership void in the Democratic Party, it's been Bernard Sanders for quite a while. Them denying this is to their (and everyone elses) detriment. Just run Bernie/AOC and let's get this over with.

Nancy Pelosi is the leadership of the Democrats. And AOC was not allowed to become top house dem. They chose Gerry ~~Atrick~~ Connely instead.
AOC and Bernie will never be allowed to do anything besides sheepdogging progressives into the Democratic party. And at this point it appears they are fully on board with that.
- At some point they have to fall in line and follow orders. Or fade into obscurity. It's a truly shitty system. One long overdue for a big reset..
- Sheepdogging is why Bernie's out on the road right now.
- Pelosi, Schumer, Jeffries may control the official party apparatus, but when it comes to communicating and connecting with constituents and energizing the base, AOC and Bernie are clearly the only ones acting as opposition leaders.

The voters deserve a lot of blame here.

You can lead a horse to water....

Any ADULT can easily see that politicians are going to be imperfect, and no single candidate is going to align 100% with your stance. Demanding that they do, or else you'll vote for literally the worst possible option, or sit out, or vote a "protest" vote, all so that someone, somewhere will "learn" something is just fucking childish and stupid. And this will be continue to be true no matter how many times the Tone Police show up to admonish people about blaming voters. Sorry, not sorry: I blame the voters.

Defeated Democratic candidate: accepts responsibility in the lightest possible way
Liberal fanboy: Noooo, it's not your fault, it's the children who were wrong!
- I didn't say Walz, Kamala, Biden or the Democratic Party in general have no blame.
I blame the voters.
It means you never have to listen or change in any way, so of course you do.
- LOL, I am a voter. Are you under the impression that I have any direct influence over the Democratic Party? 🤣
- says the guy, responding to the guy who literally voted for that fucking party.
I agree, I'm also happy that people like Walz seem to want to give people a better option, making a protest vote even less appealing.
Any ADULT can easily see that politicians are going to be imperfect
The best I can do is fall for blatant Russian propaganda and then get mad when someone calls me out on it.
- It sure is convenient how all criticism comers from russians so you can ignore it.
- TRUE I LOVE TAKING UP ONE SIDED POSITIONS LIKE FUCK ISRAEL I HOPE EVERYONE IN THAT COUNTRY DIES A HORRIBLE AND PAINFUL DEATH
  ~~this is satire, hi hello, im doing political satire~~
Nobody demanded that Harris align 100% with their stance; they demanded that she not be an absolute pile of shit of a candidate. That distinction matters.
- she was actually pretty ok? The one thing that was bad about her was the israel stance, which is like maybe 5% of the voter base that ACTUALLY cares about that enough.
Harris could have aligned with 99% of what I wanted, but that 1% was OK with genocide, and that should have been a red line for anyone.
- So, the alternative was little d, because that's so much better?
Tim Walz explained it the other day at SXSW.
Politicians are like teachers. If it's Tim Walz's job to teach kids about geography, and then test them to check if he taught well, if the outcomes of that test show that half the class passes and half fails, then the blame for that is on the teacher. The teacher could have taught differently, teaching in different styles to adequately reach out to students where they're at in life and according to their specific learning styles. He might teach the same topic 5-6 different ways to capture as many people as possible.
The Harris-Walz campaign didn't do that. They had terrible messaging as soon as the DNC hit. When Harris brought Walz on, there was actual progressive momentum. But then Harris bent the knee to establishment Democrats, and they lost the election.
I will not believe that it's the voters' fault for the election outcome. If Democrats were sober enough to realize Trump's threat and wanted to really fire people up, they would have may the necessary changes to do so.
based and true, thank you.

DNCs fault for blocking Bernie

i cant imagine its likely he would've even won in the first place, literally just schizophrenia politics.
- Sure as opposed to the totally stable and sane politics of today🙄. The establishment neoliberals aren’t popular . It’s just a fact

This headline is trash. He's saying we wouldn't be in this mess if they'd won. The headline makes it sound like he's taking much more blame than his actual quote implies.

I read it as “we didn’t win because we didn’t try hard enough.”
He states pretty clearly that democrats need to offer more than just not being another person.
- It's unfortunate because he was definitely not the problem.

Props to him for taking ownership of it. It means a lot even if it isn't fully his fault.

He's much more down to earth than the democratic establishment, or even Harris.
At least, this is the vibes I'm getting.
I don't blame him, despite not knowing that much about him.

I don't blame Harris or Walz. I don't even blame Biden, the senile old fool that he so clearly is.

I blame the Americans for fucking up the most outrageously obvious binary choice in history.

Has there ever been an election so obvious? Even during Trump vs Clinton one could almost be forgiven for giving Trump the benefit of the doubt as a "political outsider", but by 2024 we knew exactly who this fucking guy was... The fact that people today are acting surprised and outraged about all the stuff that's been happening during Trump's first 1.5 months is only further proof that Americans are perhaps the dumbest amnesiacs to infest the Earth.

Literally all we had to do was vote against Trump's particular brand of fascism.

But Americans are the type of people who fail a single question true or false quiz because they forgot to write their name at the top of the page, and we deserve to suffer the consequences of our collective stupidity over and over until it is bred out of us, or until our society falls. The American people allowed this to happen--and not just Trump, but everything bad that has happened over the course of American history.

I blame Reagan
The good think about the 2024 US election was that the choice was obvious to everyone who paid the littlest attention; the bad thing was that Americans chose the wrong candidate anyway.
I'll go ahead and blame Biden for you
My favourite part is how he made gains in (virtually?) all segments. It seems the economy was their number one concern too. Imagine thinking the current president was going to make the economy/their financial situation better...
Like at some point you just need to call out the stupid.
Biden, the senile old fool that he so clearly is
That shit made me chuckle because of how true it is. Also, the way that you worded that is so perfect. Beautifully put.
Nah, it's the Democratic parties fault. They could have prevented this. It's their job to do so!

It's so obvious the democratic party lied about Biden to get through the nomination phase and used the fact that the money already donated for the campaign was specifically to Biden or Harris and would not have easily been given over to any other new candidate. You do have to wonder, especially after how Trump was greeted by them, just what actually happened here. The fact is that the truth about Bidens condition should have been known, he should have decided not to run, and the Democratic party should've had a real primary for real candidates and new ideas. Tim Walz was as bad of a VP pick as Tim Kaine. The white guy as VP to shore up the right wing vote is a total myth. Biden was kind of the first one, then Tim Kaine, then Tim Walz. It just doesn't work. Neither will Newsoms podcast attempt at finding common ground which he hopes will translate into moderate votes. Democrats really have no clue just how bad things are about to get...

I wouldn't be surprised if Newsom pulls a Tulsi Gabbard and switches sides. He had Charlie Kirk (of TPUSA) on his podcast where he "completely aligned" with him on trans rights (i.e. eradicating us), then had Steve Bannon on. That's a bit much even for the Liz Cheney flank of the DNC.
I suspect Newsom doesn't see any future for his party, and is bailing out instead.
- In my experience, the higher up you go in both parties, you tend to sort of arrive at the same places with the same people... and most importantly, the same donors and the same money machine. That's the great thing about the U.S. dollar really, corruption and selling Govt from Citizens United to today sort of drives the bipartisan nature of it because it all greases the wheels of the two party political machine.
  I've listened to several episodes of his podcast... I'll probably continue listening but in the first episode Newsom basically kept saying he only got into college because his scores were low and he played baseball. Then he kept backing down to Charlie Kirk, Bannon, etc, while constantly saying he doesn't know what to do and kept asking them for ideas. In the first episode, there was a moment where he said Jesus Fucking Christ or something to Charlie Kirk, which called him out on it. It's like, the very voters he's trying to go after will hear that and stop at the first episode. He will gain no allies on the right as he abandons the party he is supposed to believe in, along with the core values he is supposed to defend. He thinks having a podcast with right wing guests where he gets sort of transactional on the issues. Like, do you think giving up the trans in sports debate is going to win you anything when their entire side would like to see gay marriage go away entirely? While you claim to still even support that? Do these people even think any of this through?
  If Newsoms approach is the best the Democrats have to offer, then it might be game over for a very long time...
- That's EXACTLY what I'm expecting, when he stood up to Trump I thought he'd be alright, but the dude has basically been courting the Far Right and going all in on being as transphobic as possible.
  He'll run the sadly profitable "I was on the Left peacefully drinking Kombucha and eating Avocado Toast like the next pink pussyhat wearing hippie, but then they went too far when they tried to tell me the Holocaust actually happened! They've gone completely nuts!" grift.
- I’ve been wondering if there’s a gas leak at Newsom’s house. The hell happened to him?
the truth about Bidens condition should have been known
It was known, and lots of us were shouting from the rooftops about it, But Democrats and liberals did everything they could to shut us up, accuse us of being Russian bots, accuse us of helping to get Trump elected, when it was liberals that got Trump elected by ignoring the people that saw every single sign
- It didn't help that the New York Times and other media outlets were all in on talking shit about Biden, and that undermined their credibility on the age issue. It was only after Biden's disastrous showing at his debate with Trump that the average voter had any credible evidence of his decline.
And every time you point this shit out, people will stick their fingers in their ears and say:
You had a primary and we all picked Biden!
Ignore that the 2016, 2020, and 2024 primaries were effectively just for show! Ignore that they argued in court they have no reason to follow democratic policies in their primaries!
Ignore the evidence that the media hated outsiders that threatened their bank accounts and loved the ones that increased them!
Turn off your brain and cut out your tongue, vote blue no matter who we pick for you!
- Ignore that the 2016, 2020, and 2024 primaries were effectively just for show! Ignore that they argued in court they have no reason to follow democratic policies in their primaries!
  the law literally says they don't have to lmao, go take that up with the DNC or something.
It’s so obvious the democratic party lied about Biden to get through the nomination phase and used the fact that the money already donated for the campaign was specifically to Biden or Harris and would not have easily been given over to any other new candidate.
the argument for this one is that the super pac was biden/harris, not any other random person, so it's questionable whether they would've been able to use super pac funding at all especially at such short notice, given the technicalities of super pac funding. The majority of DNC funding, sure, but super pacs are most of the money in elections these days.
Gavin's going to run more Diet Republican than any Democrat ever before and that's going to make even my "Blue, no matter who!" ass not vote for him. I'm already thinking about staying home in '28 because Trump can't win a third time and Gavin's a transphobe.

Meanwhile Democrats are lining up Rham Emanuel and Gavin Newsom to run. Lol

And Gavin Newsom started a podcast and is cozying up to crazy right wingers.
It's gonna be newsom, and they've already chosen for us.
I hope I'm wrong.
No one lines up anyone. Stop spreading agitprop.
I imagine it'll be a pretty large primary cohort this season. If you want to run, feel free to run, too. There is no cabal.
- If you want to run, feel free to run,
  Peak lib delusion. This disconnect from reality is a big part of why y'all lose.
- It is prohibitively expensive to run for president. It's only for the super rich now because for some reason we conflate money with skill even though they are unrelated.
- This has been demonstrably untrue for the past two Democratic primaries, and the people in charge of the DNC largely haven't changed, but keep huffing that copium.

It wasn’t really Tim’s fault. I will never understand why Kamala decided it was more important to try to court Republicans than get Democrats excited. Democrats, and I know this will be a big surprise to Democratic leadership, don’t want to vote for conservatives.

I just want a candidate who calls out the fleecing of the American people to the benefit of the 1%.
To stop breaking everyone down to this or that identity. The Repugnacans are doing a great job of making this look like it's about identity politics and the Dems keep taking the bait. It's not. It's about money and power. They are happy to throw red meat in the pit and walk off all the richer while we squabble.

She's a genocidal cop (aka prosecutor). She has literally spent her whole life opposing leftism. Ofc she campaigns to/with republicans.

Kamal Harris voting record as a sitting senator

Policy Area	Key Actions/Positions	Left-Wing Alignment
Economic Policies	Supported Sanders' plan for free public college, proposed six months of paid family leave at full income[2].	Strongly aligned with progressive economic ideals.
Environmental Policies	Proposed a $10 trillion plan to achieve net-zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2045, opposed fracking[2].	Advocated for aggressive climate action, exceeding even the Green New Deal.
Healthcare	Co-sponsored "Medicare for All," initially supported eliminating private insurance but later moderated[8].	Strongly left-leaning, though moderated stance on private insurance.
Housing	Introduced the "Housing Is Infrastructure Act" to invest $100 billion in housing, focusing on public units[2].	Robust support for affordable housing and public infrastructure investment.
Labor Rights	Received a lifetime AFL-CIO score of 98%, indicating consistent support for workers' rights[4].	Strongly pro-labor and aligned with union priorities.
Judicial Appointments	Voted against most Trump judicial nominees and supported liberal appointees as VP[8][5].	Consistently aligned with progressive judicial priorities.

Kamala Harris's Senate record places her among the most liberal senators, consistently supporting policies that align with left-wing ideals across economic, environmental, healthcare, and social justice issues[1][2][5].

Citations: [1] Kamala Harris is extremely liberal — and the numbers prove it https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4816859-kamala-harris-is-extremely-liberal-and-the-numbers-prove-it/ [2] Analysis of Kamala Harris's Economic Record | City Journal https://www.city-journal.org/article/analysis-of-kamala-harris-economic-record [3] Kamala Harris: Where does she stand on key issues? - BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-53770654 [4] Sen. Kamala Harris - AFL-CIO https://aflcio.org/scorecard/legislators/kamala-harris [5] Kamala Harris' liberal record is hiding in plain sight https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2024/sep/5/kamala-harriss-liberal-record-is-hiding-in-plain-s/ [6] Where Kamala Harris stands on 10 key policy issues, from ... - BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx924r4d5yno [7] Political positions of Kamala Harris - Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Kamala_Harris [8] Fact check: Is Kamala Harris the most liberal member of the Senate? https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/17/politics/kamala-harris-most-liberal-senator-fact-check/index.html [9] Voteview | Sen. HARRIS, Kamala Devi (Democrat, CA) https://voteview.com/person/41701/kamala-devi-harris [10] Senator Kamala D. Harris (1964 - Congress.gov https://www.congress.gov/member/kamala-harris/H001075

The "Weeeeird" stuff would have knocked Trump right out of the park.

i want walz and aoc in 2028

we don't blame you tim we love you ❤️

I don't love him, I don't even know the guy and politicians are generally horrible enough people to give me pause.
He DID seem to have the only decent angle of attack with the "weird" stuff so that looks good at least.
DNC will never let it happen.

Instead of frittering away the last few months of his presidential term, Biden should have just resigned and allowed Harris to take over his role. She could have pivoted way to the left without having to undermine Biden's agenda and that would have really sent a clearer message to the democratic base.

She could have pivoted way to the left
But she wouldn't have.
If voting patterns of America ever showed something consistently, it is the fact that shifting to the left in any sense never works. You can sometimes entice the public with enough vigor so they don't focus on your politics, but outside of very rare cases, shifting to the right consistently brings some votes, and shifting to the left consistently brings loses.
And no amount of social media posts was able to change it weirdly enough.
It might have something to do with consistent anti-voting narrative of a lot of the vocal leftists, coupled with their bafflement that they consistently don't get a desired outcome.
- Counterpoint: Obama.
- If voting patterns of America ever showed something consistently, it is the fact that shifting to the left in any sense never works.
  Sounds like a great excuse to only move right.
- It might have something to do with consistent anti-voting narrative of a lot of the vocal leftists, coupled with their bafflement that they consistently don’t get a desired outcome.
  i think its primarily age demographics, and the fact that the voter base is stupid, i.e. votes for the wrong people.
honestly that may have helped strategically, i don't think biden was "out the door" by that point, but it very well may have been a good look and given some needed press time to harris.

Fucking finally. A Democrat we we can respect, because they don't rely on their role inthe damage.

Walz was the VP pick, he had no choice but to toe the line with the top-ot-the-ticket (Harris and the DNC), who sidelined Walz and prevented him from promoting many of the progressive policies that Walz passionately supports. As VP you can't just come out in opposition to the runming Presidents platform, that was one of the major problems of the campaign.
- Yeah, I really don't like the Democrats and don't agree with Waltz 100% at all, but it's clear he is at least a genuine person caught up in a shit organisation.
I'm not American. but it always seems to me like the Democrats immediately tie themselves in knots trying to meet the Republicans halfway, when everyone knows they have no intention of budging an inch.
It's like if two people share a meal, one person goes "Should we split this bill 50/50" and the other one just says "No fuck you, you pay 100%." Then the first person, instead of telling them to fuck off, says "Okay I'll pay 75%, how's that?" and the other one just refuses until they eventually pay about 5%, then complain about it for the next year and tell they first person that they still owe them for the 5% they paid.
Then the first person invites them for dinner again.
- The flaw in your analogy is neither one is paying.
  They're arguing about how much we should pay, even though we only ordered a plain salad and water, and they both had surf and turf and champagne.
  The Democrat starts off by saying it should be 1/3 each, but the Republican argues until the Democrat gives in.
  The Democrat tells us we have to pay the bill, but they'll cover the tip if we let them pick the restaurant next time, and we agree.
  Then they don't leave any tip.
- It's been clear for a while both some of the Dems, especially the Dinos are getting money from the same donors as the GOP

Clearly he’s a Russian plant. Everyone knows we should only blame voters and never the politicians who lost.

I blame the DNC and Harris far more than him, he was a relatively minor politician recruited by them pretty late in the game. Everyone was worried he'd be too boring, but despite the background character designation, he still came across better than Harris.

Well, I mean the worst Walz did personally was maybe his performance against JD, but that's pretty small compared to a lot of other errors that can be attributed to the collective campaign decisions and DNC as a whole. And yes, Biden. And really, 2020 and 2016. Actually fuck it, compared to all the butterfly effect possibilities, Walz is such a small part of why we're in this mess, lol. I still want the 2000 supreme court to support the Florida recount that actually says Gore won.

Still, kudos for taking responsibility.

I wouldn't place any of it on Walz, this is all about Harris/Biden. He did well in his debate, he was obviously more progressive than Harris and was pretty much just reined in.
I think if the ticket had been reversed, they'd have won. The center wasn't ready for a black woman to start with, and when she was just parroting the same party line re: Gaza, and cozying up to fucking Cheney's, for crying out loud, it turned off the progressives that might have voted.

I already had some respect for Walz, and it has now grown by leaps and bounds. While much of the messaging from the democrats seems to contain some level of voter or constituent blaming, Walz is out there taking responsibility.

So it seems like it's going to come down between Gavin The Transphobe and Tim Walz for 2028, and honestly Tim Walz is who I learn more towards, dude feels like a second coming of Bernie.

Meanwhile Gavin started out in 2025 being the strong man who stared Trump down, but he not only folded, he sold out transpeople.

Anyone who carries water for the "Transpeople are crazy and giving them basic human rights is going too far" is a danger to us all

Who is Gavin? Newsome?
- The guy Democrats want to run for President..
  Problem he is a transphobic piece of shit who sucks the toes of Charlie Kirk
I wouldn’t even vote for Gavin and it’s not the trans shit he just did it’s that he stands for nothing and is just playing hang out with fascists. I’d rather trump tbh
That's only if Trump gives up his power after his 4 years... very unlikely. He will just start a war and impose martial law or just let the supreme court add a law that removes the limit, like they already proposed and if that doesn't work, voter fraud with all the government officials getting fired is easy peasy. I think it's over there is no comeback other than a bloody and voilent civil war or fascism until imperial collapse.

Dude should get a pep talk from the lib shills on Lemmy: Blame the voters!!! \s

But only the ones to your left. Still have to court the fascists.

Well, how much money do you have?

finally! I hate when peope are always blaming trump or maga or republicans for this shit when its been the democrats every time. reagans deregulation and tax cuts, bush juniors war on terror, trumps total idiocy. ALL DEMOCRATS! We need to stop fighting the republicans and work with them against our common enemy.

Republicans ARE our common enemy, at this point... Democrats have been an "enemy of my enemy" scenario for decades now, but they are LITERALLY the lesser of two evils. Howsabout we get rid of this BS two-party system that's allowed the Overton window to go so far right? Maybe start there, not "work with cuntservatives.
- Democrats have been an “enemy of my enemy” scenario for decades now
  Unconvincingly.
- news to me. Everything I see is lets fight the current administration by bitching about the democrats not quite doing enough in the past. Its only by rectifying the past that we can solve the future. do not be concerned about the present.

Everyone is blaming politicians as if it wasn't the fucking voters that decided to elect a pseudo-fascist into power.

The Democrats wanted to stop the pseudo-fascist. You elected them. It's not their fault, you elected, now own it. Stand to your choice and don't try others for your terrible choice.

Everyone blaming voters seems to forget that outcomes are the goal here. You can say what voters 'ought' do until you're blue in the face. But the reality is that if we want the outcome of defeating fascism, we have been shown on multiple occasions that simply not being a rapist traitor isn't enough. When the answer to cries from the voter base is, 'these are your options so shut up', they don't leave their couch.
So do you want to scold or do you want outcomes? Because scolding has repeatedly not worked to stop fascism.

I hate seeing these Democrats question themselves and their honorable positions on important issues, just because they think they lost. We all know in our souls that HitlerPig, Skum, and the Russkies STOLE the election, but the Dems quickly rallied around the concept that they got beaten fair & square, because they didnt want to be seen as the same as the 2020 Republicans. So they threw us to the wolves, and have totally abdicated their oath to "protect and defend the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic."

The Dems have to stop acting humiliated and embarassed, and get ANGRY at having our nation stolen and dismantled. HitlerPig was able to get his followers angry enough to attack the Capital, but Dems couldnt even be bothered get their followers to even question it.

The Republicans now have the Dems questioning their entire future direction. Should they move to be more progressive, and embrace Medicare 4 All, UBI, higher taxes on billionaires and corporations, harsh punishment for traitors, etc. Or should they claim the middle and try to draw reasonable Republicans to their side. Theyve tried the latter many times, and even if they win the election, being Republican Lite only makes it easier for people to shift a bit more right and vite MAGA.

Its true that people want a different sort of America, but only about a 3rd really want the MAGA direction. Most other citizens would prefer a direction that gives them more security in housing, jobs, food, and healthcare. Even Republicans would like it if the Conservative Propaganda Machine wasn't constantly telling them that implementing those programs would trum us into Venezuela. If the Dems really supported a true progressive platform, and sold it properly, the6 could win - in a FAIR election.

But we will NEVER have another fair election until the Democrats acknowledge that the Republicans have fully rigged the voting system, and do something to punish those who did it. If we dont, the 2026 election will see most Democrat congressional reps in Red states flip Republican, even in Blue districts, and in 2028, HitlerPig will win with 98% of the vote.

nice bait bro

Looking at the disinformation on social media I don't think they could do much.

I saw people being convinced that Harris had positions that were compete opposite of her actual stances.

I even saw people have complete opposing view. For example about situation in Gaza, I saw:

pro Israel people being encouraged to vote for trump, because Harris was supporting "Hamas terrorists"
pro Palestinians being encouraged to not vote or vote for trump in protest, because Harris was strong supporter of Israel and it won't make any difference

When narrative is already controlled by social media that already is biased toward specific candidate, it is impossible to win.

I don't think Harris, Walz or even Biden could do anything when everything was attack against them.

We either need to make sure that non far right is also represented in social media.

Alternatively Democrats would have to use a celebrity, for example somebody like Jon Stewart of whose popularity could cut through the disinformation.

Progressives like Bernie and AOC, they are after what we actually need, but they are not immune from this disinformation, only people who actually pay attention to politics know them the rest of population can be easily persuaded that they are just "commies that want to kill America"

- That way part of the "not vote". There were some that did vote for him.
Losing on both sides of an issue is the whole reason triangulation isn't a political cheat card.
It's purely vibe based. Everyone is just pick a choosing whatever specs of information drift their direction.
- I disagree with you about what everyone picks and chooses. The reason why people complain about Mastodon as an alternative to Twitter is because they have to choose what to see, they are used that the website would choose things for them.
  Social media for dangerous, because they build profile about you and they know what topics will trigger you. So people who are pro Israel will get one content, people pro Palestine get different, but both of them will tell them to vote for Trump.
  This is so much more dangerous than TV, which of course could manipulate people to make them react in certain way, but at least it couldn't target individuals like social media can.

Just existing as an alternate to chaos should have been enough.

Genocide is not an order worth supporting.
- Cool so now we have the same genocide but everything else is worse too? Awesome. Love it.
- I'm curious, given the choices that were put in-front of the voters at the election, and considering the whole ballot, what would you suggest would have been the best course of action for a voter to take to minimize harm or even seek a positive outcome?
  If your point is that it should never have come to that, then I would agree with you, but it did, so what would you have suggested voters do?
The guy who tried that and failed is telling you it wasn't enough.

coming from someone who worked with Trump to fund the jackboots manhandling the oil pipeline protesters

Walz is a fucking tool just looking for upvotes

Gotta love those downvotes \s. Libs love capitalism/oil more than life/planet.

I think this is a half assed acceptance of responsibility. Firstly i don't believe our democracy even functions anymore. Our entire political system has been compromised by money, bribes, campaign contributions from billionaires. Both the dems and republicans are both fascist parties. The Democratic party any where else in the world by the standards of the rest of the developed world is a center right wing party we have no true left opposition party in the usa. The democrats are clearly a controlled opposition party who's primary goal is to appease their wall street military and prison industry profiteer donors and prevent any policy shift to the left in order to thwart economic democracy and continue the class dictatorship that is modern neo liberal western “democracy” which is inherently undemocratic.

There are 14 defining traits of fascism and 13 of them are present in both partied albeit to differing degrees. But the one trait that both parties work to maintain s plausible deniability as to its existence is fraudulent elections. But to think that even though money has corrupted every other aspect of our political system that for some reason maybe the ideals of American exceptionalism and the integrity of democracy itself, that one aspect of fascism is a bridge tok far to cross and those with extreme wealth and greed who lack all humanity and show no self Restraint on any given day would at least control themselves there for the good of mankind? If you truly believe that i have a bridge to sell you.

In germany the highest constitutional court decided in the last 10-15 years or so(i don't remember when exactly) that electronic voting is unconstitutional because it is impossible to differentiate between fraudulent results and legitimate ones for anyone who isn't a cuber security or IT expert and its important that laymen(or lay people) can understand the results of an election and see the proof for themselves. And even if we put all this aside in 2016 we saw the Iowa caucus (a democratic process void of electronic obfuscation)deliberately manipulated for clinton despite sanders supporters outnumbering clinton supporters 2 to 1 and i remember seeing a video back then(i wish i had saved it) of election workers doing a test on a vote counting/tabulation machine to verify results and the machine completely skewed the inputed data which distressed all the workers participating to the point where 3 people were in tears.

This isnt a “trump was right” statement because those who are nominated by the party are most likely complicit and know who will be chosen and even if they do not know till the media puts out the results and manufactures the consent of the people they still very likely know the reality. And Trump definitely knew in 2016 and had no problem the election was rigged then because it benefited him which means he doesn’t care that the election is rigged so long as he benefits and gains power from it.

But regardless of what i believe it is the reality that every thing about our society is rigged by the ultra wealthy. And it is naive to believe that they would allow the workers the ability to choose who governs them when they regularly make it clear what they think of us. That we are a disposable commodity who’s existence is only a means for their own end. As a labor pool to exploit and wring dry for profit so they don't have to do any of the things they see as beneath them while they live in opulent luxury and spend more on weekend vacations than you or i could earn in a dozen consecutive lifetimes.

Now in the crazy off chance that our democracy actually does function (which is just impossible given the way the world is currently run by the .001%) then the democrats lost because they refuse to move to the left and they intentionally lost because their donors are the dame donors funding the republicans and democrats are under orders to sabotage any leftist populist candidates to maintain the class dictatorship that their billionaire owners have established and aim to maintain at all costs.

Now let the butthurt neo liberal downvotes ensue.

No, we'd be "GAmBlIng wItH wOrLd waR THree!"

Because Biden and Harris shouldn’t even have been the candidates in 2020…
This, it's sadly time to admit that a woman cannot win the presidency, America is too backwards for this.

All the democrats had to do was field a white male opponent against Trump who can be charming and give good speeches. Instead they put up a biracial woman, who the fuck amongst the democrats thought that America was ready for a biracial woman president, like did they do zero pooling to figure out what the people wanted, aren't politicians supposed to know the pulse of the nation, it's literally their job to serve the citizens of the country. They should have made Bernie or even Walz the presidential candidate and Kamal could have been the VP

The "she lost because she's a woman of color" talking point is just an excuse to shut out AOC in 2028.
- You think voters can't be sexist or racist?
All the democrats had to do was field a white male opponent against Trump who can be charming and give good speeches. Instead they put up a biracial woman
she was literally the previous VP, about the best pick you're going to get, especially from a functional party, as much as people will tell you the biden admin didn't do shit, it's one of the more productive admins, in a long time.

You played it too safe and used your son as a prop