US Democracy

Plain and simple... She was a woman, and a black person - There will be months of tap dancing and "deep" analysis, but we're just an ugly, atrophied, broken, racist and patriarchal nation, like deep down in our DNA. We were able to elect Obama, yes - he is half white, and a man (those weren't the loud messages as they attacked him, but Pennsylvania gramma knew those things quietly when she pulled the lever for him). It's not satisfying, but it's just the plain truth here. We're closer to getting over race than we are over sex.

Plenty of deliberate work has been done, mostly by republicans, to keep America stupid, poor and in untreated pain, yes... But we're also just trash on the whole. We raise trash and we vote for trash. We just aren't smarter than social algorithms, TV soap opera narratives, costumes and makeup. "The pretend business man is white, old, wears a tie and has a gold watch. He feels like how daddy felt when I was little, and when things are bad, daddy fixed them the way I remember it."

Video game trolls, people who failed the cop application physical and triple DUI wine moms are America. No further explanation or analysis needed.

This reads like straight out of disco elysium. Great choice of words
- Thanks, I still need to play it. Maybe a good distraction for a bit to regroup and prepare for a rough road ahead.
I remember hearing many democrats that joked how they voted for the white side of Obama. It wasn't funny and isn't funny now. They are not only voting against a woman but one of color.
We are going let christian fascism take control of America because a large portion of our population is sexiest, and racist. Not to mention all those protest votes or fucker who sat on their couch rather than do the right thing.
Now we are all fucked.
I voted for Harris walz, but I think a lot of this is the fault of Biden for trying to run for reelection and sticking it out until July. I live in the south and I think the lack of a primary reallly hurt the ticket because a sizable portion of the people I’ve talked to felt like she was appointed instead of being elected, which is a bad move when public trust in our institutions is already at an all time low.
- This is all excuses. The fact that Trump made it all the way as the primary candidate for the GOP means that Republicans were okay with what he said and what he did.
  For a normal person, it shouldn't even take a second to choose Harris. But this isn't the case. Trump won the popular vote and the presidency despite all the crazy shit because a sizeable part of the citizens voted him in regardless of the reason.
  And not only that, but Republicans won the senate and well on their way to win the house.
  It is about to get real bad, and Americans have themselves to blame for that.
- Institutional democrats who thought they knew what they were doing and could ignore the base of the party is to blame. Biden being top of the list. Stubborn self assured who when finally pushed to change was only willing to do it on his terms. And made a decision for everyone, again.
  One of the big stories is a Democratic party Mayor of a super Blue city being corrupt and organizing police to defend him and yet not a single member of the party has spoken out against it. Endorsed by Hakeem Jeffries.
  Status quo is far more important than listening to their base right now and hopefully it changes instead of them once again thinking they need to head further right.
  And for the love all things holy I hope the Democrats learn to stop "gaming" the election with specific counties in "blue walls" because they did advanced math that told them it was all they needed. Bare minimum should never have been the goal.
- The people you talked to are bigoted cowards that wouldn't have been swayed by any of that shit - She has a vagina and she's black - That's all it was ever going to be.
  You're hearing the thing they hope their neighbor would think of them after the fact, " I was this close, Bill... I just wanted more policy detail... More time... If only they didn't make me vote for trump".
  Your neighbor fucking sucks, Bill - this is the time you pause, take a breath, and fully internalize that to inform your future interactions.
Obama was a unique situation in that he was both an incredibly charismatic JFK-style figure and ran after the Republicans had managed to both start a very unpopular war and destroy the world economy.
- Barack Obama also never released a campaign ad that said "Hey white dudes, we only think some of you suck."
I don't think it's just the fact that she's a black/Asian woman.
I saw this on BBC News which is probably correct:
[Trump has] completely "reimagined" the Republican party from its country club voter stereotype to appealing to working class families, while the Democrats had become the "party of Hollywood".
- “Imagined” is perhaps the right word considering he wanted to raise taxes for low income people, and lower taxes for rich people.
- Frankly, that just shows hollywood is overhated and voters are stupid
Setting aside whether she would've won had she been a white man, she could've made up for that handicap by appealing to the right people if she had actually been trying to win. Pinning it completely on her race and sex simply ignores her absolute failure of a campaign.
- And you're an expert on ignoring failure
While this is a large part of it, a significant thing I think is that you get a lot more enthusiasm voting for something than against something. If she was campaigning for things I didn't hear it above the constant "orange shit is an orange shit".
A number of terrorist bomb threats to predominantly democratic polling locations in swing states and other fuckery may have also played a role.
- Maybe care about things. Voting against him should've been enough to elect a ham sandwhich
I get more the sense that people don't care about her so much - or him either for that matter - so much as how things in general just "feel wrong". I'm no expert but the news media having been bought out seems a likely culprit. Jon Stewart tried to warn us but we would not listen. He did his part, but if people don't value things, they tend to fall - or in this case be taken - apart.
Totally agree. After all the progress the US is still not ready to accept anyone else than white men at the top.
Should have stuck with the British Monarchy, powerless as it comes. A woman as head of state for 70 years and even better, no elections for any president during any of time.
Slowly but surely I'm coming to terms with our modern reality

Wisconsin, US here. My county went 70% for Trump this time. That's versus ~48% in 2016. The problem isn't democracy. The problem is the people. Pissed as hell for all the wrong reasons at all the wrong people. Unable to see reality, expecting that the person in charge could make it a utopia with the flick of a switch. The average American is delusional and irreparably stupid.

We constantly joke that it's Idiocracy, but the truth is...

Thank you for saying it. The voter is the fucking problem. Anyone with half a brain realizes this. Gaza, egg prices, and the candidate not having a dick was enough to the traitor rapist felon to get a trifecta. That's not a campaign problem. Maybe Harris didn't run a perfect campaign, but that's clearly not the issue here
- I'm not American. Maybe my opinion also comes from a place of not understanding how government works in the US. But in 2020, Biden won the Presidency and the Democrats had control of the House and the Senate. Yet, they had a harder time of reversing Trump's policies than he had pushing them through. Let alone not even trying to enact progressive policies.
  As an outside observer, maybe that's why people have lost faith in the Democratic party.
This. Was crazy to see everyone turn on the DNC and Harris the moment it was over like we are just unable to come to terms with the fact that we're surrounded by garbage and morons and there's no way around it
- The results aren't showing that though. They are showing a large amount of Democrat voters just stayed on the couch. Trump didn't get more votes than 2020, all that was needed was an energized democratic base.
Yeah uh, I really really hate to say it, but... democracy worked this time. The voice of the people is "Trump please". Democracy just means you get what most people want, not what the best option is.
- I'm pretty sure the majority of people mourning the loss of democracy aren't saying it because they feel the democratic process was broken this election, rather they say it because Dump vowed to dismantle democracy and serve as a dictator.
- At least we'll always have Costco that really lifted my spirits 👍

I can't tell you how much faith I've lost in the average person in America, especially compared to how... ok, I guess, the last election went and how tight, or possibly over this one is.

I can't fathom how fucking stupid anyone would have to be to elect this orange piece of shit that has been upping the dangerous rhetoric constantly. America is broken and it isn't worth fixing, especially not for the morons that somehow get him elected again. I just hope that I can get to a point in my career that I can move elsewhere, maybe Ireland or New Zealand or something, fuck.

For real. The rest of the world needs to get their shit together and cripple the US. Cease all trades immediately, end all alliances with the US. The US has the largest military in the world, and now the facists have the reins entirely. They have the oval office, the have the house, they have the Senate and they have the supreme court. The entire world is going to suffer because of this election.
- US politics have gone to dangerous direction for decades. Orange freak is only a symptom. US is gonna become Russia level cleptocracy and when climate crysis hits fully, world will be more separated and chaotic than ever.
- There may not be any need for that.
  The United States, China, etc. all have trade policies that are fundamentally unsustainable and result in persistent trade imbalances.
  This causes all sorts of poor economic outcomes for large sectors of those countries. For example, an anaemic household sector in China and over investments in housing, huge private and public sector deficits in the United States, etc.
  In the free market world of Adam Smith and comparative advantage, persistent trade imbalances should not exist.
  Over the medium to long term, imports are meant to pay for exports.
  If there are persistent trade imbalances, it means there is persistent under consumption (China) or over consumption (United States).
  Note: This is not just limited to these countries.
  At some point, there is going to be an economic crisis because it can't continue forever.
- God you blue conservatives are ridiculous.
  You'd rather support the death of America over doing away with the two party system.

Remember when the US-Government dropped fucking poison Gas von striking Miners?

Maybe this whole US-Idea was not that great to begin with.

Remember when they bombed a neighborhood in Philadelphia?
- Holy fuck.
- Remember when they burned children alive because their parents may or may not have modified some firearms.

Also say goodbye to internet freedom of speech, if even a small portion of Project 2025 comes into play. Anti-pornography activism sounds nice on paper, until you realize everyone has a different definition of pornography, and the people that want to ban porn the most have a rather interesting take on what constitutes as porn and what doesn't...

- Some people define porn as the stuff corporations do, except they will side with anyone that promises a blanket ban on stuff.
It absolutely does not sound nice on paper.
“Anti-pornography” specifically means “anti-LGBT” to them.
- They will extend it to mean anything outside of what their version of Christianity allows, which will include a lot of straight people
Anti-pornography activism sounds nice on paper
I am absolutely ashamed I'm forced to vote along side you by First Past the Post voting. Disgusting.

When you figure out that the United States was established by wealthy white males who owned slaves, had a revolution due to "no taxation without representation" but then purposefully ignored to repent the 99% until major reforms over the years, it makes sense.

The first set presidential elections were only voted by a handful of Americans. Not the women. Not the slaves. Not the natives who were here first. The landowning white men.

When we claimed England is a tyranny but abolished slavery and gave universal aufferage before we did, I think we lost that argument. America was built by out of touch white men, and it has always been ran by out of touch white men.

Rebecca Latimer Felton, the first woman elected to the US House, "spoke vigorously in favor of lynching African Americans, under the pretense of protecting the sexual purity of European-American women."
Not to mention that the civil war was lost through the presidential election of 1876 even though it was won in battle before that. That election was so corrupt that the Union conceded a lot to get their president, including removing Federal forces from the South on the promise that the South would protect Federal rights of minorities, blacks, etc. (among other things) The North pulled out and the south reneged without consequence (the KKK was the strong arm then) until the Civil Rights act in the 60s. That's only roughly 60 years ago. Most of the institutional segregation from before then is still firmly in place.
It's amazing the stories that Americans tell themselves about the American Revolution. They pretend that the "founding fathers" were heroic idealists standing up for honorable values against an evil despotic regime. The truth is much more complicated.
A major goal of the 7 Years War was about controlling the colonies in the Americas. Had the French won those wars, the modern people of North America would probably speak French. Look at how many US places still have French names, and especially are named after the French king: Louisiana, Louisville, St. Louis, Mobile, New Orleans, Baton Rouge, Detroit, Lafayette, Arkansas, Illinois, Calumet, Decatur, Boise, Montpelier, etc. But, the French lost the war, so the English took over all that territory. Fighting that war was incredibly expensive, but it was worth it for the English because they now controlled a whole new continent with all its resources. To pay for that war, they levied taxes. The English colonists in the US, who were largely the beneficiaries of that part of the war, decided they didn't want to pay those taxes, so they rebelled. They got the benefit of a continent won for them by English armies, but without having to pay the bill for that fight. Now, again, it's complicated. The English armies were integrated with the colonial armies. George Washington was initially an officer in the British army (and was part of starting the French and Indian wars, which became the 7-years-war). The US colonists were part of the force that fought against the French and their native allies.
Anyhow, it was complicated. But, the end result was that after a war that took place both in Europe and in the Americas, the British crown had a huge debt. I have no idea what proportion of that debt was due to the part of the war fought in Europe vs. the part of the war fought in the Americas, but overall there was a big debt and the English crown tried to tax whoever they could to pay for it.
Was the English king a tyrant? Sure. Did the Americans have fair representation in the English parliament? Probably not. But, their main reason for rebelling was the same one that is nearly always the cause of rebellions: the rebels are in an area that's wealthy for some reason, and they don't want to have to share that wealth with the rest of the country / empire. In fact, it was suspected that the colonists chose not to send representatives to the colonial assembly partially because they knew that if they did that it would undermine their "without representation" argument, and the real issue was that they simply didn't want to pay taxes.
As for the English system being tyrannical, the reality is that it has been a very slow, gradual change from an absolute monarchy to a ceremonial one. The English crown is significantly less wealthy than Elon Musk, and arguably has a lot less influence on British politics than Musk does on American politics.
By the letter of the laws, the British system is still more classist and controlled by money than the American system. But, is that true if you look at the actual real way that power is used? It doesn't seem like it to me.
- I particularly enjoy the bit about how after the French helped us win our revolution and took some revolution home in a doggy bag. We reneged on our debt claiming "Our deal was with the king."

Clownocracy

FWIW most clowns are hard-working, skilled individuals who bring joy to people's lives.
- Are you a clown?
Clown country

Yeah, a two party system with two right wings only.

That wouldn't work.

Anybody got that American political plane meme handy?
- This one?

Funny and true. I like it.

Well, it is nearly dead now.

US is system is so bad. The constant pandering to "founding fathers" as if it's even possible to have strong enough vision that it would last 200+ years and refusal to innovate past the ridiculous two party system is just sad tbh.

Yet nothing will change because you can't change these things without a revolution apparently.

Not to mention that the founding fathers would hate what has become of American politics...
- YOU FREED THE WHAT?!
Some states have already replaced First Past the Post voting actually

Kind of feels like our "crossing the Rubicon" moment. Except instead of an intellgent and accomplished general leading an army, we got a clown leading a circus.

It’s a democracy controlled by people who don’t care about regular working people. It was designed by rich white dudes and slaveowners 250 years ago to protect and increase their wealth.

Your institutions have failed you. Americans need to demand better and throw off the chains that the wealthy have put on them.

You mean an oligarchy then
- That’s an accurate term too
They willingly put the chains on every morning before heading to work.
- Mortgage to pay, health care insurance costs, kids tuition, ...
  Slaves to the systems of life.

(in spirit since I am not American)

Part of that joke though is that they're both exactly the same which is of course a false premise.
- Well I was posting it more to the point of the I am sure wave of people saying "Well I voted for the Dems" is fast approaching.

this is what a terminal case of neoliberalism looks like, kids

You guys should have listened to Thomas Paine, the only founding father with a clue and a set of principles.

Topical.

Why, what did he say?
- political institutions should promotoe individual rights and social equality
  critqued organized religion
  the government should serve the people
  wrote the famous line "These are the times that try men's souls" during civil war
  people have the inherit right to reform and/or dismantle oppresive goverments
  all individuals possess inalienable rights (human rights basically)
  That's what I gather from his wiki and some chatgpt queries. Never heard of him before (not an american) but honestly — I'm a big fan now.

Not that I'm advocating for it, but it's completely legal for Biden to order the assassination of Trump and Vance. So yeah, US democracy is dead.

I hope the American people will resist any draconian measures there are bound to be, whether with civil unrest or other forms of protest.

Yet y'all have an audacity to blame people from authoritarian states

Henceforth it shall be admiration.
- Unironically yes
Russia and China have nothing in power compared to the genuine pure stupidity of Americans. Decades of brainwashing a populous will get you further than invading it from the outside.

If American democracy survived Jackson, Buchanan, Hoover, and Nixon...

You're making this statement while standing over a dead body. Need to pause for a moment and smell the flesh starting to turn right beneath you. This is that moment. There was never going to be a letter embossed with a seal sent to you to announce it. America is dead, our neighbors quietly suffocated it with a pillow. And today is the next day. The changes will be quieter, more subtle at first, but longer reaching, more impactful and longer lasting.
trump wasn't elected, a train, driven by hate and fear, overflowing with explosives that's been fixed on everything you think you know about America was elected. The holocaust branded with trump's name will be quieter, I imagine it will take longer, but it will probably collectively kill more.
America is the name of a country that used to attempt to maintain democracy. It's the country the failed that mission in 2024. Anything you hear otherwise is self soothing. You're entitled to it though, we all are, because hope is dead and that's what used to bring us back to earth in difficult moments.
People are not basically good. People don't "come to their senses" and we're all just so fixing tired while they are all just in so much fucking adderall.
musk will be in charge of the National Highway transportation safety board
rfk jr will oversee vaccine production/distribution
abbott will lead formation of the National laws on abortion and miscarriage
joe rogan will be the named author on a new fairness doctrine (that won't actually be)
tim scott and lindsey graham will co-chair the committee on reforming LGBTQIA+ rights
steve bannon will be on every month's cover of normal skin magazine
that church guy and trump's close buddy that just got in trouble for abusing kids will be in charge of repealing the sex offender registry
mike johnson's son will be in charge of porn
betsy devos will come back to finish devastating the DOE as public education is killed in favor of vouchers to religious schools
and brawndo will be what plants crave.
Maybe those of you that stayed home will actually read protect 2025 now. It's all going to happen.
- America is dead
  You're thirty years to late to write The End of History. Fukuyama wasn't right about it then, either.
  Maybe those of you that stayed home
  Speak for yourself. She only lost because you didn't vote hard enough.
- The holocaust branded with trump’s name
  Uh, no thats not true at all. Harris Biden and the DNC are 100% oboard with the genocide too. Are we collectively pretending thats not true anymore, so that we dont have to learn any lessons from it?
- America is dead, our neighbors quietly suffocated it with a pillow.
  Canada and Mexico?
They all paved the way for trump to fucking topple it.
Nixon (also Reagan and Johnson) severely damaged it, Trump is just the end stage.
Things are quite different. While Trump was in office, he did multiple things that were worse than what Nixon did, and was never forced to leave office. I think our institutions were stronger back then. We didn't have a very good democracy when Hoover was president, and it took many decades for the Voting Rights Act to get passed (which has recently been weakened by SCOTUS, and will probably be weakened much more). I think we'll regress quite a bit. Republicans obviously want more of an autocracy/oligarchy. I think it's a very real possibility we have Russia-style "elections" in the future, and I don't even know how you come back from that. Assuming democracy isn't completely destroyed, it may take many decades of fighting and changing the minds of the people who aren't disenfranchised to get back to where we were. Hell, even civil war is on the table if Trump follows through on some of his more egregious promises (i.e. if he deems Democratic state governments as the "enemy within" and tries to use the military to depose them).
Then it’ll probably be so exhausted it won’t survive trump?

On the bright side, at least we'll finally be rid of the motherfucker on Inauguration Day 2029, assuming he doesn't keel over from oldasfuckitis before then.

You think if he still alive and president that he will step down then? Nope one he will have charges dropped against him. Then he will use four years shapping this country into is imagine. By time he done this country will be so fucked there will be no fixing it. And war against climate change is over.
And if Democrats do happen to run again they will move futher to the right.
- It will all be about the judges. The last time he was in office, there were more judges appointed than ever before. This time, we will see even more, and at that point, there is no stopping any ridiculous changes that will inevitably be set forth by them to change everything. This will secure everything they want for decades to come. It was hard to see how it would be managed even with democrats winning, but now I can't see ever bouncing back from this within my lifetime.
I would guess the people behind trump will probably look to get rid of him ASAP since all Trump cares about is himself.

Kleptocracy

It's not too much different to the chinese democracy. There isn't even a direct democracy

Now is time for the "well, if we don't develop it first, the bad guys will" superpower to show itself off, I guess.

If we had a more representative electoral system, more of the non voters would be engaged by the political process. More voters always has lead to more democratic votes.

Why is the democratic party saying no to these easy extra votes when they fail to replace First Past the Post voting in states they control between elections?

"We won it last time! Why change now? Besides, proportion representation only leads to more parties and that'd mean we'd have to... cooperate."
- Heaven forbid we would have to compromise instead of ramming legislation only we like through to pass.

I hope our future dictators are handsome or beautiful and that they come with nice body parts, so when we have to suck their dicks, we can at least enjoy it.