r/The_Donald helped radicalize users into far-right identities and discourse – Active users on r/The_Donald increasingly used white nationalist vocabularies in their comments within three months.
r/The_Donald helped radicalize users into far-right identities and discourse – Active users on r/The_Donald increasingly used white nationalist vocabularies in their comments within three months.
I know most people that were on reddit at the time are fully aware of this and won't be surprised but don't dismiss the findings out of hand. It's important that studies are being conducted and the fact that the finding match our lived experience is still noteworthy.
Literally everyone on Reddit could see this except spez, who is a greedy little pigboy
Oh he could see it too and didn't care because he's a self proclaimed libertarian.
Remember when they lifted the no racism rule? I do.
Yes. And I really should have left Reddit then and never looked back.
It was a hilarious mask of movement. They did it to "own" /r/Sweden in the subwars and obviously got their asses handed to them.
Reddit or the sub?
The Donald.
insert shocked pikachu here I mean, is this really surprising? That place was a cesspool disguising as irony. But news flash, it stops being ironic after a certain amount of time.
It’s not about how expected this was. It’s about the fact that we have data to prove it, and it is definitely a probable phenomenon.
Incidentally, I’d be fascinated to see the data the alphabet agencies have doubtlessly gathered on what major players on /r/TheDonald are affiliated with foreign agents (primarily Russia, though China and Israel absolutely had a hand in it too), or just straight up foreign agents themselves. I hear they’re going to release a big report about that on February 31st.
disguising as irony.
About this. It was legitimately funny at first, when the Orange One had no chance.
The thing that turned it so fast from absolute satire into not at all satire was the immediate, within seconds, banning of anyone who called it out as a joke. The speed of those bans convinced me that someone was being paid to steer the narrative in their desired direction 24/7.
It was a masterclass in modern propaganda, and I'm glad it's being studied.
I learned personal lessons from it. I'm absolutely more PC now, because you never know who's going to take your absurd joke seriously. As Waddle said, if you say something ironically enough, it stops being ironic.
a cesspool disguising as irony
See also: various still-existing places such as PoliticalCompassMemes
While it certainly is a bit of a captain obvious moment that exposure to far-right echo chambers helped radicalise vulnerable people into the far-right, but I can see the merit in having empirical evidence supporting what we see (as OP said) - it is a lot easier to dismiss an andecdote than statistical evidence
To add on to the people pointing out that science is data:
Yes, it is incredibly obvious that the turmp fanclub subreddit would radicalize people to become white nationalists.
What is not obvious is that this is happening everywhere. And, if you get a hold of one of the "leaked" white supremacist recruiting guides from the 80s and 90s, that is by design.
South Park Libertarians and all but it really is telling how many people, to this day, insist that the f-slur for gay people is really "Oh, we took that back. it means obnoxious motorcycle drivers". Let alone statements like "har har, you are so butthurt" that (regardless of what urban dictionary says) are on the same level as "ha ha, you are gay"
We see it every day. And it makes communities hostile. And if you call it out, you get driven out. Which means there are fewer people around to say "... what the fuck? How can we think this is acceptable?". And then someone whose entire vocabulary is "lolzors go woke go broke pepe pepe" gets rightfully made fun of elsewhere and now they are a victim and all those "for the lolz" become their identity.
Yes, it is incredibly obvious that the turmp fanclub subreddit would radicalize people to become white nationalists.
They're polarizing and definitely hateful.
But as the volume got cranked higher and higher, I think it encouraged more silent disgust than popular approval.
You just couldn't see it under all the pro-Trump spam.
And then someone whose entire vocabulary is “lolzors go woke go broke pepe pepe” gets rightfully made fun of elsewhere and now they are a victim and all those “for the lolz” become their identity.
The online Shoot And Cry strategy. Always be the victim.
the f-slur can't be reclaimed for me, personally, I'm happy for those who do reclaim it but its just too painful as it's what I got called when I was badly hurt and was worried I would die as a 12 year old.
However, those who do reclaim it then use it around me, which just makes me think about what happened - involuntarily - and ruins my day (or part of it).
It's also tricky being a bi man in a het relationship in this regard, as if someone knows that it's hard to overcome their feelings that due to my partners existence, I now no longer have a say in these matters.
I would've been curious to see what kinds of words got counted as "far-right vocabulary" but it appears that research has recently gone back to being effectively concealed behind paywalls for those of us not in academia.
It's 2024, anyone feigning ignorance about what constitutes a "far-right vocabulary" is just being disingenuous.
That's not really true. Anyway, the "supplementary material" provides a few examples at least. We can only assume that they should be representative and that care was taken in drawing the boundary between that sort of thing and less objectionable but culturally adjacent terms.
One can assume, yes. But that's not especially scientific, is it? What's the point of the research if you can't look at the methodology?
Someone else defended the post from people saying "well d'uh" by saying we need to corroborate our theories and not just assume they're correct. Kind of hard to do when research is hidden behind paywalls.
Why are we downvoting this comment? It's a perfectly reasonable thing to wonder about the study, and I had the same thought.
Not because I can't possibly imagine what could constitute "far right vocabulary..." But just cause I'm interested in the study methodology.
Like yeah, any of us can often identify far-right language when we see it... But how did the researchers approach that systematically? Are there any surprises there, like phrases that I wouldn't recognize? Did they include patterns like "randomly capitalizing words for emphasis?" That would be interesting to know.
Or maybe I misunderstood, and the people downvoting are just pro-paywall, idk.
Some people seem to be more concerned with this study "feeling" correct more than it actually being verifiably correct.
This won't make Spez any more uncomfortable when he wants to sleep at night. According to him, that subreddit was "valuable discussion".
No. Fucking. Shit.
Any and I do mean, any conservative based subreddit all now function the same. r/conservatives have turned into a shithole. Hell, even TrueUnpopularOpinion has turned into it's own shithole because it's just a foundation for right-wingers to express their radicalized thought processes for all to see.
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Yeah, I've always described r/Conservative as The_Donald dressed up in their dad's suit and tie. But once The_Donald was finally banned (after they already left for their own website - thanks for nothing spez) r/Conservative dropped all pretenses.
R/republican was a right wing echo bunker, too. I got banned for pointing out that the letter in the "article" that someone posted that claimed that the DOJ had found massive voter fraud in Georgia and asking the state to reject Biden's win was actually written by a Trumpist shill and contradicted the Republican AG, the DOJ, the Republican Governor, the Republican Secretary of State, and Republican election officials.
I asked them a couple of times when major events in the prosecution of John Eastman occurred if they would reconsider. They blocked me for 30 days each time. When he was finally disbarred I asked again and they told me that if I didn't stop asking they would report me to the admins.
Delicate little snowflakes in their echo bunker.
r/unpopularopinion was a shithole. Any sub called "realXYZ" "QRS2" or "TrueABC" is just the "free speech" version started by someone pissed that they got banned for using slurs, so I'm not surprised r/TrueUnpopularOpinion went to shit. I'm surprised you think it was decent at any point tbh.
If you ever want to observe or engage (be ready for the pile-up) with these same folks, r/ShitPoliticsSays contains the exact same user-base of extremists. These are dyed-in-the-wool folks because they use this as a launching-point for brigading other subs comment threads. Lots of Canadian righties there, too. The only credit I'll give is unlike r/conservative that they never censored so you could pretty much discuss and test argumentative points to your heart's content.
Just read the thread covering this very article about T_D lol
Of course I still think a sizable chunk of these folks operate in discord channels and astroturfed Sanders subs (especially the 2020 election), ChapoTrapHouse, etc.
I don't know what they mean. I hung about in there for three years and I never picked up any white nationalist vocabulary.
This article sounds like (((globalist))) propaganda to me!
Edit: Incidentally, I was perma-banned from reddit for making a similar joke there.
Yes, that's why nazi digg kept them around.
Weak, all of them
Did it actually radicalize, or just take the mask off? They may have used vocabularies they always wanted to.
Using an original dataset of Reddit user posting histories from 2015–2017, I test for increases in the frequency of this far-right vocabulary.
I think there's a lot to be discussed on the topic but I wouldn't put much on this methodology.
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Radicalization happens yes, it's a question of The Donald specifically doing it. It's not so big that many people will just randomly stumble into it like Fox (which is passive and 24/7). People have to kinda seek the sub out and engage. At that point they were probably quietly, let's just say, racist. So I put that in the category of mask off. I know people they could do that.
Did it actually radicalize, or just take the mask off?
When a community allows you to feel comfortable "taking the mask off" and embracing your inner bigot that is radicalization. So yes, The_Donald did radicalize people. Your comment is an attempt to highlight a distinction without a functional difference.
I guess you could define radicalization like that, but I'd define it as taking regular Joe with no hate and you know radicalizing them.
Radicalization (or radicalisation) is the process by which an individual or a group comes to adopt increasingly radical views in opposition to a political, social, or religious status quo.
Yeah I think there's a difference between radicalization and mask off.
Honestly, before now, this is what I had implicitly assumed was going on. I'm not American, and I had blocked most of this trash when it was happening, but my impression was that these ignorant people were just "coming out of the woodwork" so to speak.
Of course, fear and hate are learned behaviors, but it's interesting to me to see that these people were actually being quantifiably radicalized by that website in particular, and they weren't simply bringing views to the platform that were being established elsewhere.
People are emotional creatures. And in a place where a type of view is being actively promoted, it's very easy to align those emotions in that specific direction.
An example here on Lemmy is ACAB. It's anti-police and it posts the bad stuff that's meant to show ACAB. They might say it shows the truth and people going through All, watching the videos and reading the articles might start thinking, huh cops seem bad. They keep going, read statistics and articles posted by other commenters and driven by this information, they eventually end up saying ACAB. Suddenly, anyone not saying ACAB is complicit, an enemy, a troll, part of the problem etc.
It's the same for any politically charged social hub. It's not just people who had the views but lacked a place to vent them, but people who are ignorant on the subject and are radicalized through emotional outrage. Emotional opinions are the hardest to change because the investment in them is the greatest.
i thought the donald got banned, guess there's a new the Donald.
Please read the link! It's a study of that time on Reddit when the Donald was growing rapidly.
read the link
Blasphemy!
thanks for the info, i will be potentially forgetting it .
yeah, but i'm sure theres plenty of other subreddits doing the same shit. Reddit doesnt get rid of bad actors, it just redistributes them.
I would be extremely interested if things changed after the sub went private.
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4chan was pure weaponized autism in those days. They still call Trump "The meme president".
weaponized autism?
They've very much revealed that they come straight from 4chan.
r/The_Donald helped
radicalizeextremify users into far-right identities and discourse – Active users on r/The_Donald increasingly used white nationalist vocabularies in their comments within three months.FTFT. I so hate it when people who should know better ignore the actual meaning of terms.
And today the front page is still being used to push fanatical American extremism, just in a different guise. American progressives are just alternative Trumpists. It’s horrifying
Lmao the fascists are ready to burn down Reddit faster than greed would