Why are US states, school districts banning smartphones in schools?

Because the little shits (affectionate) don't want to put them down when appropriate

Am I the crazy one? Millennial myself. We had cell phones and got detentions for using them in class. When did that stop being a thing? Why is this a question at all??

You're there to learn. You sneak texts between periods. If we were caught our phone was given to the principal
- In the 2000s and early 2010s, less of your life was lived on a cell phone or smartphone.
  
  For kids now, it’s 100% of their lives. Post-COVID, the majority of social interaction between peers is through a social media app.
  
  That means that close to 100% of kids are on their phones during the school day. If you aren’t, you run the risk of social isolation and FOMO.
  
  Administrators can’t send a kid to detention for using their phone because ALL kids would be in detention every day.
  
  Here’s one article that examines the problem
- Based on my interactions with teachers, the administrative class that runs these schools are cowards who don't want to deal with angry parents, nor the liability if the phones get confiscated and then stolen/damaged. There's also a lot of parents who want to text their kids during the school day and get mad when they can't. A lot of teachers have given up since the higher ups won't back them up. This happened around 2015 or so, when smartphones became ubiquitous.
The lack of etiquette is really frustrating. Had a tech student that was always putting in both earbuds as I was speaking. Had to walk over and wave my hand in front of the screen to get their attention.

When they graduated they said they were excited to get a job in the industry. Internally can't help but think "with what knowledge or experience? You spent the entire class blocking it out."
- Somehow they passed though, right?
Ah yes... Affectionate condescension and authoritarianism. The best kind.
- The same way that I'd call my cat a little shit if she was being a brat for the fun of it like she does sometimes

I usually let my students keep their devices, but I had one student… I had asked everyone to write 5 sentences about a made up place. The kid was on his phone, showing things to his classmates while assuring me he was doing his work. Everyone finished but him, with nothing. I let every other student share their answers first to buy him time, then when it was his turn, nothing. I took away his phone and he had it done in less than a minute.

Sounds like you should have taken his phone away when everyone else had finished, or before that, since he was distracting others. Also sounds like the assignment wasn't challenging enough for him.
- You’re right on that I should have taken his phone away sooner, but he was the weakest student in class. Three of his sentences were the same sentence said more and more poorly each time. Not sure what he thought he was getting away with there. Of course I did a peer correction check of his presentation and had him do it again.

It's disappointing but not surprising to see so many people (on lemmy) willing to violently control children and their access to tech, information, etc.

It's pretty telling when people don't want to do anything about the many other much bigger causes of psychological harm. Where's the law that stops cops from harassing minority youth? Yeah right.

Peeps are literally upvoting Ron DeSantis. Fascism is not the goal here. Wake up, y'all.

Come off it, not being allowed to be on your cell phone during school hours isn’t the same as KOSA.

The APA document you linked even specifically discusses the effects of social media (what do you think they’re using their phones for?) on mental health.
Christ almighty, that was dramatic.

Not being able to use your cell phone for the duration of the school day is fascism.

Fascinating.
- I always wonder what kind of experiences people like this had in their life to reach such a state of delusion. They also claimed schools were "literally mini-prisons that feed into into actual prison" and suggested that asking students to pay attention in class was "authoritarianism".

Anecdotally, yes it does improve attention in class. I have friends who are teachers here in Australia and they are all massively in favour of the bans after a year of them being in place. The problem with the scoping review quoted in the article is that it conflates several different issues and suggests phone bans in schools are supposed to be a silver bullet for all of them. You are never going to solve the mental health and bullying problems with a phone ban that only lasts half of the day, five days a week. Those problems require much broader policy and greater responsibility from parents. Another problem is that research into the effect of smartphones on schooling (which does actually suggest improvements) generally focuses on test or exam results, which are not a reliable indicator of whether students are actually learning or gaining anything from the experience of school.

To add to your last point, academics aren't even the biggest problem: it's youth mental health that's in a crisis right now. Focusing on academic "success" itself is a problem. Academics will come if students have mental health and resilience.

I agree with the conclusion of the article:

“School’s the same for 120 years, where kids go nine to three, have long holidays, sit at desks and have to regurgitate what the adults tell them to learn, basically all over the world. We’re blaming kids for falling academic standards, we’re blaming the rise in mental ill health, we’re blaming the rise of cyberbullying. Oh, well, it all must be the fault of the mobile phone,” Marilyn Campbell told Al Jazeera.

“I mean, what a simplistic view of how we are educating our children in a different world and taking away that main tool that we’re all using in society and saying, ‘No, the kids can’t have it now’.”

A balanced approach, involving regulated use and clear guidelines, may be the most effective way to harness the benefits of smartphones while minimising their drawbacks, experts say.

The general recommendation of Campbell and Edwards, who carried out the scoping review in Australia, was to leave it to individual schools to determine smartphone use and to focus on helping children to use smartphones positively.

As an educator and parent, I couldn't disagree more strongly. Smart phones are addiction machines and childhood experience blockers. Children should not have smart phones at all until age 16. Age 16 would be a very appropriate time to introduce smart phones after their harms have been explained in detail at ages 12 through 15.

Banning cell phones during instructional time doesn't go far enough. Students having a smart phone in their pocket is damaging. (Dumb phones are fine—SMS texting and phone calls are great.)

There has been a precipitous decline in youth mental health globally in nations where cell phones were affordable starting in 2010. The evidence is clear. Smart phones (and, more broadly, addictive dark patterns in all apps/games) are a big problem.

If you want to learn more, read the first chapter of The Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt. (I'd recommend the full book if you want details, but chapter 1 is enough to give you a grounding in the data and the broad strokes of the argument.)
- Out of curiosity, (given that in another comment you talked about home schooling) when you call yourself an educator, do you have a teaching certificate in your state, or other professional teaching certification?
  
  I'm not trying to be rude, but since you began by invoking the title of "educator" as an appeal to authority in this area, I think it's important to clarify that you are in fact such.
- I mean, why wouldn't we just ban smartphones for everyone then?

I am in full agreement that cell phones should not be out of the backpack or pocket unless there is an emergency or it’s lunch time / outside of class.

But for the love of critical thinking, also please ban the teachers from using ChatGPT to create their tests for them. I was appalled at finding out teachers at my kid’s school are doing that. While I support any tool (and funding!) that can make the lives and jobs of teachers easier, using a tool like ChatGPT is as irresponsible as telling kids to just Google it. And teachers/administrators should damn well know better.

Cool, so pay teachers more and give them ample time and resources to not need to cut corners.

Also using ChatGPT is fine, not checking the results after is not.
- Agreed on the teachers getting more pay and time.
  
  And I agree that checking for objective fact with respect to teaching and testing is necessary.
  
  But…ChatGPT is not a credible source. So using it in the classroom is not exactly fine (outside of showing it as an example of a source that isn’t credible). It is in its infancy and any educator who uses it in the classroom and relies upon it is doing a considerable disservice to those they educate. That’s like teaching using Wikipedia. I get that it has information, many times accurate, but it should never be used as a source.
  
  As a commentary…Far too often in this modern world people (not you, just a general sense of society) seem to see something that may be 50, or 75 percent accurate and claim it as fact. This is how entertainment news organizations function to get ratings. And if kids are to be taught critical thinking they must be taught how to discern what is or isn’t credible.
  
  Otherwise we’re lost. And perhaps we already are.
There is no emergency that can't be handled by the adults of the school.

I can understand needing a phone for the commute, but at school it should stay in the bag turned off.
- I hear you. But my child will have a cell phone in case of a real emergency when the adults don't properly act. While I trust teachers rather implicitly, my experience with most school administrators is far less stellar. Also, a student calling 911 when the teacher is having a heart attack or some other life threatening event will save time and possibly their life.
  
  Barring any emergency situations, my child's phone better be put away.
- There are emergencies the adults at the school won't understand. This has happened a few times to my spouse, where the nurse/teachers kept brushing off issues they didn't understand, ranging from things like asthma to strep throat.
  
  Otherwise, I agree that the phones should be put away during class.
Depends how they use chatgpt, if they use it tlfor content that can be troublesome, but here its being used as a format tool. You copy some previous test and ask it to reorder the numbered questions ( to precent class before giving the AACDBA series of answers) or use to copy paste in a large test and tell it to strip out every other quesotion, renumber and replace body text with double line spacing. For stuff like that it is a godsend.
- Perhaps. I concede maybe it makes mundane tasks simpler and quicker.
  
  But it should most definitely not be used for fact-based research and testing. Not yet and not until it is proven to produce only credible fact backed by credible sources.

I'm currently rebuilding my math foundation and part of that process was tracking down high quality educational resources with passionate instructors, rigor, and entertainment factor (because I want stuff to recommend to parents). I did eventually find something that was better than what I got in grade school, but I have to say that the Pythagorean Theorem just isn't going to be as interesting as social media feeds and entertainment products custom tailored to my preferences. No teacher is realistically going to be able to compete with the multi-billion dollar entertainment industry for attention and tech companies are abusing psychology research to make their shit as addictive as possible. It's not the biggest problem with the US educational system, but it is one of many, so I'm down with restricting smartphone access at schools.

Because people are out of touch, saved you an article

Well I don't think that is the case. Parents and teachers are observing students not paying attention.

I would think if an educator can teach a full lesson, while also ensuring that students retain the information, when the student is watching YouTube, endlessly scrolling reddit or lemmy, or on Instagram this wouldn't be an issue.

The problem is that students aren't retaining the knowledge being provided to them.
- Here's the thing, in general. Phone or no phone, the problem your mentioned is down to the teacher. I've had good teachers that are able to make a lesson entertaining and guess what. That actually works, people aren't bored to death and shit gets done.
  
  To contrast, boring lessons, even without factoring in phones, nobody gives a shit for good reason. We just focus on something else, wetger that's a phone or something else isn't a factor. Its rather the lesson itself
  
  To address the retaining info part. If somebody talked to you for about half an hour on some random thing you don't care about. How much do you think you would remember or focus on. Spoiler alert, probably not much

Just say you hate neurodivergent kids already....

I don't see the connection between neurodivergence and phones
- A lot of research actually shows that neurodivergent kids rely on online spaces and communities, especially for companionship and social interaction. Forcing a lot of neurodivergent kids to sit in a chair for 8 hours and stare at a whiteboard never worked, but everyone used to just not care. They just sat there suffering, got sent to ISS and ignored, or got kicked out and sent to juvie.
- Another comment already said everything I was going to say in a far more eloquent manner, so refer to @t3rmit3@beehaw.org 's comment below :P
A camera in every pocket isn't so good for the ASD kid being mainstreamed into high school with a severe phobia of having his picture taken.

Got several kids at regular public schools (not in US) and their policy never allowed phones during school hours from the start. It is pragmatic and doesn't cause any drama. The kids get messages home if needed and can collect phones when they leave. It is a relatively normal society where kids walk and ride to school by themselves and parents aren't obsessed with stalking kids or bubble wrapping them.

Schools have a duty of care and sadly are as much baby sitters for working parents as they are places of learning and phones create more problems than they introduce opportunities.

In general; I don't think banning them will help. By all means; confiscate phones which do not get put away during class and return them after class. Give teachers and administrators the authority to do this.

Offer appropriate places to securely store and charge phones in each classroom until the teacher releases them. These places remain "locked" or "inaccessible" until class is over.

Do this from a young age and teach the children how to have moderation through this method.

I do not believe children should be deprived of their devices before and after school. If a student is found to be bullying other kids or students online; then charges can be filed in a school-based court and a Judge can consider ordering the bullying kids to have limited or no access to any smart device unsupervised. This puts the burden on the parents to manage any kids who are misusing the tech outside of school. Similarly the troublemakers can be transferred to other schools.

Students who are being bullied online can simply report this to the teachers or admins and get relief from their tormentors. If they can't also learn how to get the adults involved in actually troublesome situations; that's also a problem that needs addressing.

I would encourage students to be open with their parents and teachers about things and definitely also focus on things like social media literacy and how to navigate through tricky situations as well.

Various apps and software tools could be used to manage a student's phone (During school hours) as well; if and only if needed. They could make this mandatory; but it would only be restrictive on phones of students who misuse their phones; and thus are identified as needing 'management'. This would ideally only enforce appropriate usage times and optionally; iff the student is being penalized for bullying or misusing; provide a way to disable various apps and browsers while preventing new ones from being installed without parent or teacher consent.

TL;DR: If the kid follows the rules; their phone isn't going to be locked down. If they don't; they get the lock-down experience while the adults ensure the kid is educated as needed.

Even if that sounds dystopian; it's also a way to integrate phones into the school experience which addresses all the issues...and ensures the adults in charge of the students has ample opportunity to educate the kids about how to use their phones correctly...and intervene with a student's usage if needed while still allowing them to have phones for emergency and necessary use.

You seem to care about this, but just FYI that it's well studied at this point that having a smart phone at all during school hours is a problem.

It's not about cyber bullying. Having a smart phone in their pocket is damaging. Children should have dumb phones exclusively until age 16.

Outside of class time sounds good, but it really means that students become fixated on checking all their notifications between classes. This is an experience blocker. Instead of engaging with their peers or teachers, they're screen zombies caught in addictive dark patterns, generating anxiety constantly all day.

I've plugged it already in this thread, but The Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt explains this really well , and he brings receipts.
- Having a smart phone in their pocket is damaging.
  
  There is not enough scientific evidence of this; and oftentimes studies of this nature are not randomized and controlled; but instead rely on anecdotes and self-reporting by parents.
  
  Outside of class time sounds good, but it really means that students become fixated on checking all their notifications between classes. This is an experience blocker. Instead of engaging with their peers or teachers, they’re screen zombies caught in addictive dark patterns, generating anxiety constantly all day.
  
  If you read; you would know I already advocate for the students being unable to use their phone during school hours. Their phones would remain locked up; much like the article mentions; for the entire school-day.
  
  The only thing I advocate for is for them to have a phone in general so that they have it for when they need it; either in case of emergency or otherwise. Yes; that does mean they have access to it before the schoolday begins and after the final bell rings. That's intended.
  
  I do believe it is possible to raise children to resist the addiction; but it has to start early.
  
  As for inflicting a 'dumbphone' on a child; I do think that's not necessary all the time. it depends on the child and is definitely one way a parent can control a child's screen time.

I'm not sure why I see people treating banning smartphones in class like child abuse or something. The only explanation I have is that it's a cultural thing. Obviously, if used appropriately, a smartphone is a valuable tool, but this is only if they are used appropriately, which some students will do and some won't (and this varies as well from school to school and class to class). Where I went to school, a significant number of students did not use them appropriately during class, so not allowing them made sense since they distracted from the lesson.

So, why do I have so little confidence that they'll be used properly? Some people are posting anecdotes about their time as teachers in this thread, so I'll post one from the student's perspective. Despite smartphones not being allowed in my classes in high school, people used them anyway. Why? The teachers wouldn't notice, or some might just not say anything. I played the heck out of one mobile game with my friends in both of my history classes, and nothing ever happened. I knew people who'd be listening to music during class too, and completely ignore the lecture itself. Almost everyone with a phone out used it as a distraction from class, not as a tool to help them learn. Despite there being a rule against them, I'd estimate more than half of the people I went to school with used them during class anyway.

So why didn't the teachers enforce it more strictly? My guess is because it wasn't safe. Many of my friends carried knives at school for self defense. There were a lot of violent students, ranging from fights in the hallway to students being part of a gang. To be clear, this wasn't by any means the majority of the student body, but it wasn't an insignificant portion of it either.

The violence escalated dramatically after the 2016 election, where students (who were understandably upset about the result) got up and threatened all the white people in the school. I had graduated by then, but I knew people who had to barricade themselves in a room with a mob of angry knife-wielding students on the other side of the door. Many of the students in the room weren't even old enough to vote. One teacher left the school because of all the threats she'd received.

Also, not sure how common it is to have a "senior prank day" at other schools, but we had one every year. The "pranks" ranged from spray painting threats to teachers on the outside of the gym, to destroying school property. Once they had to put classes on pause while a company came out to replace the locks on all the doors since the "prank" was to destroy the locks so the doors couldn't be opened.

This school was pretty tame too, compared to some of the schools I'd heard stories of. One teacher I talked to at a different school had stories about all the times some student threatened her or pulled a gun out on her or whatever, and it honestly just sounded like hell.

Anyway, I wouldn't say I blame the kids for this behavior, and while I have strong opinions against feed-driven social media, I don't think it was a major contributor to these behaviors (this was before social media was as big as it is now). I think it really comes down to parenting, whether the parents are just bad at raising kids, or they don't have time or resources to properly raise their kids, or their kids have needs they don't know how to (or refuse to) satisfy. Regardless, a teacher can only do so much, so rather than trying to correct behaviors in students at the risk of their own lives, I think a lot of them just put up with it for the sake of the students who do want to learn.

So if the rule is going to be broken anyway, why have a rule against smartphones? It sets the expectation of students regarding smartphone usage, and gives teachers an opportunity to enforce that rule when they feel it's appropriate (and safe) to do so.

Edit: I should also add that I don't think most schools are this violent. This school was exceptionally bad, but it wasn't as uncommon as you might think to have a school this violent.

Why not banning them in schools, are they needed for studying?

In the US you sometimes hear that phones in class are necessary to see if your kids are OK in a school shooting scenario.

I think this isn't a good argument, since school shootings are rare, and it's unclear if each student having a phone would do more harm than good in that kind of situation.
- Also, dumb phones are fine. SMS and phone calls aren't a problem, it's smart phones that are addiction machines.