Bad faith actors putting on a performance about their hate for new Trek (or anything progressive)

I want to be clear here as a mod before arguments start. In Ten Forward:

You are allowed to hate any Star Trek series or movie(s) that you like.

You are also allowed to talk about how much you hate them all you like.

Just don't be a dick about it.

And also don't be a dick about someone hating those things.

CAN I BE A DICK ABOUT NON-STAR TREK THINGS THOUGH?
- Yes, but you have to avoid using words like "woke" and "diverse" and "agenda" so you come across as a generic hater.
- Yes, but there's a fine line. Can you be a dick about J.J. Abrams' Star Wars movies? Yes. Can you be a dick about J.J. Abrams' Star Trek movies? No.
  (Just kidding, I hate all of them. Just don't be a dick in general please.)
Understood o7
I'll be good
- It wasn't meant for you specifically. You're fine. I just wanted to nip it in the bud before it started.

I used to worry that I hated new Trek. Then lower decks and strange new worlds came out.

When disco fucked off to the future I started enjoying it more because it felt like it no longer didnt fit in with the timeline. And then it got to the cause of the big explosion thing and decided I hated it again for such a stupid cause.
Zero interest in Picard, feels too edgy grimdark.
LD/SNW by comparison have been enjoyable since day one.
- The first two Picard seasons are… weird.
  Picard S3, while not perfect, is a hell of a lot of fun, and very obviously a love note to ST fans who grew up with the 90s series.
  Agreed that the cause of the Burn was just… wat. Similar levels of “wat” for that seed ship interlude where the barzan father “phased partially out of reality due to grief”.. like, come on, what in the Kentucky Fried Fuck is that bullshit?
  I do think disco is mostly good, but it’s also about 5-10% catastrophically bad/nonsensical/poorly written, which can really take the wind out of your sails when watching parts of it. I must add, however, that I think the very prominent focus on mental health and trauma, as well as non-heterosexual/-heteronormative relationships was an excellent change that that series specifically introduced.
What counts as New Trek?
I enjoyed Discovery up until season 3. Then it lost me. SNW is fantastic though.
Also kind of pissy that they used the bury your gays trope. It's so old.
- Back in my day, "new trek" was Enterprise!
  Now get off my lawn.
  (I'm not actually that old. Edit: also, I hate my lawn and don't care if you walk on it.)
- I'm the opposite too, Disco really grabbed me in season 3. When Sadil told Burnham "that future is you," I was sold. I honestly teared up, you could feel the weight he carried his entire life being lifted. What a line. Plus the future is a better fit for them and helps avoid continuity issues and all that.
  All the gay killin' was disappointing, I agree there.
Feel like Discovery, Lower Decks, and Prodigy are only new trek. Rest is fan service that lacks the push of real trek series. SNW and Picard are fine but not very memorable. Except for the musical episode or cross over with Lower Decks.

Here's the thing: I dislike Discovery. I tried, it's not for me. I dislike the (for me) over-emotional acting.

But I have a hard time believe people who complain about Trek being woke are actually trekkies.

Because they never seem to get upset about far more woke episodes of TOS, TNG or SNW.

The ones I love are the ones who claim Star Trek got too political.
The Star Trek that commented on racism, the cold war and overpopulation. In the mid-1960s.
But I have a hard time believe people who complain about Trek being woke are actually trekkies.
Same here, and that's why I singled out out bad faith actors in my post. They aren't real fans of Trek any more than people who like to highlight black crime statistics in the U.S. are "just asking questions." It's bullshit, and they need to be called out on that bullshit. Star Trek has always had a progressive vision of the future; anyone who claims otherwise or complains about "wokeness" is sowing discord and trying to get people to subscribe to their brand of douchebaggery.
Never underestimate the ability of conservatives to ignore political messages that aren't explicitly stated. Even something as in-your-face as TNG's The Outcast is easily viewed by conservatives as "a funny alien story", and not a metaphor for real-world political issues.
The meaning of woke changed. That is to say, TNG isn't woke in the same way STD tries to be.
TNG is about self reflection, self improvement, professionalism, materialism, humanism, striving every day to make tomorrow better than yesterday.
STD is about emotions, entitlement... And honestly I struggle to find what the show actually says. There's a focus on CGI spectacle. But since STD contains a black woman as captain, a gay couple, and a non binary individual, criticism of its lack of depth isn't allowed.
We see the writers pat themselves on the back for things Star Trek has already done in the past, just to give themselves social brownie points, and if you don't like it you're a sexist bigot. That is what woke means today. It's not true progressivism.

Discovery makes me sad. Some great premises and actors, very little of what makes/made Trek great. What a shame.

Lower Decks is nothing but joyous snort giggles. Well quite heartfelt at times.

SNW is wonderful fun. You get your progressive post scarcity utopia (yay) and more than a few sensible chuckles. And guffaws. Also the truly grim but still appropriately Trek stories like Under the Cloak of War.

Also I would kill for a proper Bat'leth Boys music video! You have not experienced K-pop until you've heard it in the original Klingon.

Discovery is a great Sci fi, but not that good at being Trek IMO, and didn't really respect the rest of Trek. It's better now that they moved it to the future of Trek where it's tech level makes sense, and there isn't a littany of other media in the same time period.
The first seasons of Picard were weird because it felt that it was more about other characters, and the TNG characters were more there for fan service to trick the fans into watching.
Lower Decks and SNW are fantastic.
I can't believe that the crossover with the animated Lower Decks was the second silliest episode of Season 2 somehow. It was great.
I could do without the Alien crossovers though. Maybe it will lead somewhere interesting but right now it's just dumb.

New Trek isn't bad because it's progressive, it's bad because they've lost the vision of what Star Trek even is. Case in point:

That headline is a bit misleading... The season was rewritten because you couldn't understand it unless you had seen every other bit of star trek and remembered everything that happened... It required too much star trek knowledge not that it was too similar to other star trek shows.
- Picard was in fact very different from good Trek and I didn't enjoy it much, other than the pretty visuals.

Trek is like beer. There is good Trek. There is better Trek. There is bad Trek. But bad Trek is better than no Trek. And any Trek is better than star wars.

I'd rather have no Trek than whatever bullshit is posing as Trek right now.
Or to use your metaphor, There is good beer, there is better beer, there is bad beer, and then there is that weird warm yellow liquid that turns out to be actual horse urine that got sold to you like beer. That's what NuTrek is.
But bad Trek is better than no Trek.
Thank you. I've been saying that since Discovery came out. I will take any new Star Trek over no more Star Trek.
What does that make the Orville? Cider?
- I said better Trek, didn't i?

All I know is Kirk from the original series (the actor) is pretty anti progressive and from what I can tell closer to a Nazi then a star trek captain.

Of course last time I heard about him was very long time ago though

AFAIK, William Shatner is mainly a self absorbed twat and kinda a pain to work with, which was why he was on the outs with the rest of the crew for decades, but I've never seen him regurgitating right wing talking points like Kevin Sorbo or Chuck Norris.
- After he did his AMA on reddit he took a look around and stated something along the lines of it having "too much of the bad internet" and didn't stick around.
  Also he's Canadian and not from the Prairies, so unlikely to be alt-right. His biggest flaw I've heard of in a few places is that he "works to rule" in the union sense. He does things that make him money WRT his fandom and his acting.
  E.g. the big fallout he had with George Takei was because in his eyes, Takei as a person would benefit more from Sulu staying on the Enterprise and playing more in the movie, because more screen time equals more cash.
  Takei took the minor role because it made sense for Sulu as a character, as well as personally the representation of a Japanese (and then closeted gay man) as the captain of a starship.
I'm pretty sure he is a lot of things but Nazi is not one of them

Can we keep this community civil?

If you feel personally attacked when people voice their dissent against regressive discriminatory behavior, perhaps consider it's your conscience trying to tell you something.
- I just want memes

I mean I just like science fiction