Wavering Black voters: Biden is flawed — and Trump is unacceptable

It's cute how everyone is pretending there'll ever be another election if Trump gets back in. He'll feel spitted, and giving up the presidency a second time will literally feel like an existential issue for him.

For Trump leaving office will be the equivalent of feeling like he's dying, publically and shamefully.

- It's fine, just make whatever rules you want! I'm sure we'll still have the power to stop you when we're tired of your tantrum!
- Dictator for a day, every day.
Christianity emerged out of rumour and legend to grab the minds of fools and it transformed the world in very chaotic and destructive ways. Q Anon is setting up to out do Christianity. The numbers on Q's growth are terrifying.
- this a naive and reductionist view of christianity. it was actually a quite revolutionary and radical movement. god himself became human and lost faith. as zizek puts it, christianity is the most athiestic religion.
  jesus was a radical figure trying to kick the romans out of judea - which is why he got executed. he was against the organized religion and the power structures of the time. a few decades after, there was a jewish revolt and the jews controlled jerusalem for a few years. the Romans sent a large army, captured it, and decided to deal with the "jewish question" by making judiasm illegal and scattering the jews
  paul, christianity's don draper, who wrote half the bible and the earliest works of the bible, came up with all sorts of fantastic stories (3 day resurrection, immaculate birth, etc) and modified the story to make it friendlier to roman gentiles (pontius pilate washed his hands in the bible and didn't want to kill jesus. in reality he killed thousands of jews a year. he wouldn't have given jesus a second thought)
  so christianity went from a jewish cult to a fast-growing religion and that spread across the empire until eventually Constantine himself converted
  christianity is the story of the tenacity of the jewish people and the soft power they managed to propagate throughout the empire even after the empire tried to stamp them out. it's the story of a small desert people conquering the roman empire against all odds
  you reduce it so something so simplistic and naive and it's sad. people should learn the full story.
Imagine all the illegal stuff a trump will need in office in order to refill his treasury. How much he would have to sell (secrets). Imagine.
It's funny how this conversation wasn't had during the 2020 primaries. Seems like a good time for everyone to sit down and be like "ok who can we all back collectively". But as usual that's not how the primaries worked and moderates got their perfect candidate while everybody else got nothing or next to nothing.
It’s cute how everyone is pretending there’ll ever be another election if Trump gets back in
God I am so tired of these hysterical takes. What you should worry about is Trump using the machinery of state to crack down on political enemies, not him becoming dictator for life. People watch way too many movies
- The problem isn't that it's a hysterical idea, it's that Trump is dumb, unhinged, and blindly supported enough to try it. We know because he literally tried.
This line of argument died when the Democrats literally cancelled primary elections in multiple states.

It's bizarre the Republican base is so firmly behind Trump. A normal Republican would probably win given Biden's unpopularity, but the prospect of another Trump presidency is enough to get people to vote for anything with a D on it.

What's funny to me is how moderate Republicans have demonstrated they're willing to vote for a far right candidate. For leftists and progressives it just underscores how little moderates have bothered to compromise for decades.
It really revealed every ounce of corruption in this country. All is found in shadows.
honestly, I.... I wouldn't be surprised to find out both sides really are the same, and trump was put up there explicitly to force everyone into voting for Biden and his ilk. You know, maintain the illusion of choice.
(I don't really believe that. I'm just saying... you know...? )
- I wouldn’t be surprised to find out both sides really are the same
  Until 2016, I did see the two major political parties in the USA as two sides of the same broken coin. Trump brought out something ugly I thought we'd left in the past.

hmmm, should i vote for an old guy who believes in democracy or should I vote for a useful idiot to the russians who hates minorites whether it be gender or sexual preference and whatnot and would hand ukraine over to putin in a silver platter, undermine nato any way possible for daddy putin and also crown himself king and end all further elections while imprisoning his enemies and all the other things he lied about and said were being done to him.....

damn, I can't really figure it out! I can't stop WaVeRiNg!!!!!!!

GODDAMN MORONS ARE GOING TO KILL US ALL, JESUS CHRIST

this isn't working anymore. people are getting numb to the "boogeyman" technique
dems have to offer something people want, otherwise the right is going to take over
and i think it's too late by now
- Boogymen aren't real. This is not that. And the Left never had that. Right wing terrorism boogymen fund wars.
- a boogeyman is something fake used to scare people into doing what you want. trump is a real threat. the country got noticeably, objectively worse, our supreme court is now corrupt for decades to come, he defanged the epa and if he gets in again, goodby climate work, hello actually dictator. he’s directly said he will be one “for a day” lol. it’s not a boogeyman if the danger is real.
I understand the wavering. I voted uncommitted in my primary because Biden will win that without my help and it's a small way of officially filing my disappointment. But if (let's be honest, when) I get my presidential ballot and I have a choice between Trump and Biden and probably some third party, I'll hold my nose and cast a vote for Biden. As much as I hate it, it's not even a question.
- It depends where you live. If you are in a deep red state, it doesn’t matter. If we went blue enough for my vote to swing the state, Biden has already won anyway. I feel safe voting 3rd party and not giving him a symbolic popular vote.
  With no electoral college, down ballot matters. Vote blue on those!
  Make sure you vote though!
Joe Biden had a disapproval rating of 55% before Oct 7th. He wasn't doing well before Israel's retaliation and he is doing worse now. I don't think its really all the fault of progressives protesting in a primary.
https://www.reuters.com/graphics/USA-BIDEN/POLL/nmopagnqapa/

Yeah, I was working with a black guy that had a maga hat. He eventually brought it up and I pointed that out. His reply? "He's right, I hate them too."
- You work with Clarence Thomas?
- Good ole Uncle Ruckus. No relation.
- What's "it"? The fact that he was wearing the hat? If so, it's weird to talk to some stranger and just say "hey, check out my hat".

I can't believe we've voted for the lesser of two evils for an entire generation, to the point that the lesser evil is a strike breaking, border wall building, senile octogenarian that's bypassing Congress to sell arms to a genocidal ethnostate, and liberals still can't come up with a better alternative.

This whole "lesser evil" narrative is daft and it needs to stop.
If I had an army of bots and got paid to help GOP win the election I would make and upvote comments exactly like this one.
Biden is not the POTUS you "want" in a fairytale idealist kind of way. Deal with it.
The "both parties are just as bad as each other" angle only helps one side, and it ain't progressive.
- Yeah, one just has to accept "not doing a genocide" is a fairytale for America! Shut up, stop complaining, stop advocating for change in your elected leaders, and get back to work!
I'm almost 38 now and I've pretty much never had a president to be excited for. In my previous ignorance I was excited for Obama and then quickly let down by the system that kill any progress.
I really don't know what I should have expected from a country that was completely built on greed. Everyone that started it to the people that moved here (immigrants want a better future = they(we, we're all children of immigrants) want more money = build businesses = greed. Everything about this country is about money money money. That's literally it.
America is the land of the fee, home of the billionaire.
"If you hate it so much why don't you leave!?" Oh my freindo I wish I could.
- Funny enough, it costs $2350 to renounce your citizenship. Administrative fee for the paperwork apparently. They get your money at every turn in this country, I swear...
  https://common.usembassy.gov/en/renounce-citizenship/
- land of the fee, home of the knave
- Land of the fee, home of the slave
And if we don't vote for him, everything falls apart because of us despite the fact that it's been falling apart for decades.

This election is going to be a choice between getting shit smeared on your face or getting shit injected into your veins- you hate both options to the core, but only one is survivable.

No. Biden is like being made to eat your vegetables. They might not taste good but you have to do it.
Voting for Trump and Republicans is like eating shit for money. Everyone is going to be worse off, oh and only the people on top get paid for it. Everyone else is just screwed.
- Mmmm, vegetables are good for you. Voting for Biden is not a total catastrophe, but he's not a strong leader or a great influence on the world. He's a functioning adult, and we badly need him to win, but let's not pretend that the progressives who don't love the guy are wishing we had cake and ice cream for dinner.
- Don't taste good?
  Given all Biden is doing for women with abortion and ivf, he’s getting kids breakfast and lunch money, he’s helping reduce college loan disasters, Medicare is going after pharmas that price gouge, he’s the first president ever to join union members on the picket line, I could go on.
  It is not perfect and it isn't 5 Michelin star quality but it definitely tastes good.
- My vegetables usually don't support, defend, and finance genocidal states.
- Trump is like eating a full bowl of shit. Biden is like eating a half bowl of shit. You'll still be eating shit.
- No. Biden is like being made to eat your vegetables.
  "Supporting genocide is good for you!"
- Whoever thought that was a good idea is insane. Are they trying to lose.the country to fascism?
- No. Biden is like being made to eat your vegetables. They might not taste good but you have to do it.
  Who is "you" here? Because I could've made the same argument about candidates in the 2020 primaries about leftist and progressive candidates. Why don't the millions of people who voted for Biden in the primaries "eat their veggies" and help get a progressive or leftist candidate elected?
  Biden isn't good for the people who don't want to vote for him. Biden is good for the people who are insisting everyone has to vote for him.
Aside from this whole Israel/Genocide thing, Biden has been a pretty solid leader despite a completely dysfunctional congress.
- "Aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"
- Dude fucked the BBB, forced federal workers back into the office, blocked the rail strike and has Yellen and Powell in an outright war with American workers.
  He's a "solid leader" for people who are retired or about to retire.
And yet the people who chose getting shit smeared in our faces in the 2020 primaries have demonstrated zero self awareness or openness to behaving differently in the future.

Two old pieces of shit way past their expiration date.

And we get to pick one!
- Makes it really difficult to get up the enthusiasm to vote when it's all shit in some way or another, but it's important to remember that not all shits are created equal. I will without doubt pick the shit that is just old and shitty over the one that is old, shitty, and actively trying to destroy democracy in the US.

Biden is just not a good candidate. Swap him out. Pull some one off the back benches if you need to.

Only requirements are that they are breathing, and are eight years younger than normal retirement age, and they'll likely be doing better than Biden is rn.

Oh you mean all of those people on the back bench that Biden beat once already?
The people that, unlike Biden, have never beaten Trump in an election?
The people who aren't the incumbent president when history shows a very clear pattern of voters choosing to re-elect incumbents?
- I mean come on, Biden didn't win the democratic nomination. It was handed to him on super-Tuesday. Bloomberg was just vomiting money to get easy media attention and then just dropped out. Elizabeth Warren was polling well then suddenly backed out, and all the super-delegates (something that shouldn't exist) had pledged their votes well before the actual convention. Then all that was left was Bernie who got smoked because there was no time to recover
  Sure you could argue that's savvy political maneuvering which is what you want in a president but my point is that Biden didn't successfully campaign as much as he let other people do it and then got their support. Something he can't repeat as an incumbent
  Before anyone says anything, I'm voting for him, I'm just trying to avoid revisionist history
- Oh you mean all of those people on the back bench that Biden beat once already
  So? Those people he beat keep sitting on the bench because candidates like Biden can't permanently address the Republican party. You can either hand off the reigns to a smaller faction of the Democrat party or lose their votes. Make a choice.
- I'd like to think Dark Brandon will resign his secondary day in office. He just wanted to say I beat the fool now we good fam. Here, Harris you run this shit I got bingo.
Just some random blur state governer would be way better
- Gretchen Whitmer.
  Jay Inslee.
  Ron Wyden or Jeff Merkley
  Fuck even Gavin fucking shit in my mouth Newsom.
  Thats just the west coast.
  Plenty of blue governors and senators from safe blue states that can do this.
  Also, we can look outside of government. I'm very serious that a Jon Stewart run would EASILY beat trump, and he'd be far better on the middle east.

How ever will someone choose between one candidate who is unacceptable and another who is acceptable. Tough one.

They look at it this way:
Do you like to lick boots? Do you want a dictator? Are you easily manipulated by fox "news"? Are you a racist piece of shit? Are you more concerned with what your neighbor is doing in their bedroom than yourself?
IF you've answered yes to any of these, CONGRATS!!! YOU are a piece of shit and you're voting against democracy and decency. You are however, voting for Russian asset while calling yourself a patriot....

Hopefully this time Biden doesn't tell black people who won't vote for them they aren't black. That really didn't help him win them over last time.

Biden: If you don't vote Biden you ain't black. Black person: * doesn't vote * 🎉 White privilege obtained 🎉 Thanks ~~Obama~~ Biden

For the sake of DEMOCRACY, like it or not, Biden is the man that has to win

This is just stupid. Everyone is flawed. Politicians are just people. They are all flawed.

cant be having flawed humans now, can we?

Funding and arming a genocide and actively vetoing the rest of the world calling for an end to the genocide = flawed?
Flawed is all you would describe that as?
Flawed now means being a genocide enabler? What happened to the good ol days when flawed meant something benign, like cheating on a test, or your wife.