Lemmy is a bigger echo chamber than reddit

OP must have just noped out of government and economics in high school.
- He probably just hasn’t gotten to that year in high school yet
- You just described most Americans, sadly...
My first thought reading the title was "Better check his posting history, probably alt right."
They are certainly outnumbered on lemmy and face factual rebuttals without insulation of echo-chamers.
Slapping the rails like this is exactly the lack of nuance that lemmy has. You're either with us or against us. That's not how people look at issues. What matters is how people are treated. I'm not going to vote for someone who harms people. Being pragmatic to avoid a bad scenario? Don't even bother.
- Ignoring everything else, Reddit also lacks nuance. Both of these forums live in a black and white world, and I agree that you're either on their side or you're against them.
  I don't agree with other things you're saying but I really only wanted to comment on that one issue. There is no nuance.
- Good fucking god, you're a moron. How did Reddit ever let you leave?
Get 'im, Stamets!

I switched back after some drama with a petty mod. I've found that so far, the quality of content on Reddit just isn't there anymore. In fact, I'd go as far as to say it's hot garbage. Unfortunately, the niche content I enjoyed and sometimes relied on just isn't here, so now I flip back and forth between them.

I'm still beyond pissed about 3rd party apps, though. The official Reddit app is a steaming pile that wants to be TikTok SO BAD.

Why not just access via browser? If they try to hit you with the "unverified" or "NSFW" content pop up, just put 'old.' before reddit in the URL. I refuse to put that shit app on my phone for spez to use as a data farm.
- old. is unusable in mobile browsers.
- I do! Firefox with pretty much everything blocked. It's just annoying that Spez has made it so I basically have to
Same, though i did delete my account, so I usually doom-scroll popular...
It will be easier to quit reddit as they essentially certainly will make even more astoundingly stupid decisions that make things even worse in pursuit of IPO and profitability.
If reddit exists in 5 years, itll basically be a total laughing stock with only the most die hard, most insufferable, most god complexed and most stereotypical /reddit/ users, basically viewed with as much derision as maybe say 8chan is now.
- We're already quickly approaching that reality. It's pretty well enshittified
Same. I only go to Reddit for those niche tech topics that I can't find useful info anywhere else. I really want to abandon it wholesale, but Reddit has pretty much completely captured the audience for a lot of more niche topics.

Bye!

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out
- Don't let the door hit ya, where the good lord split ya!

Do you have a few minutes to talk about our Lord and Saviour, Linus Torvalds?

Also nobody should ever own a car ever. Everything should be some form of bike. Firetrucks? Nope, Bike. The trucks that deliver groceries to the store? Bike. People who live in Northern Minnesota who live a 2 hour drive from that grocery store? I don't care if it's minus 8 out get those little bitch legs peddling.
- Oh hi, I live in Minnesota. Assuming you called out the state because you live here too, I'm sure you're also aware of how bizarre this winter has been. That's because of climate change. We can make the state far more walkable, and we'll need to so we can get control on climate change.
  The anti-car movement is better described as "car transport should be heavily reduced and replaced by public transit and alternative transit". When it's intensely cold, people should be able to use mass transit like light rail and busses too. If they live in a very rural area, then yes a car will be necessary. But the point is to focus on human-scale infrastructure, not car-scale infrastructure.
Wayland is the worst, in this 4 hour video essay I will ...
- People who hate Wayland are the worst. In this five hour video essay I will...
I use Arch btw. /s

I disagree. I feel that on Reddit, the type of users and discussions were mostly toxic and based on popularity. Lemmy is far from perfect, and there are aspects about it that I feel certainly are lacking, but to suggest that it's a bigger echo chamber than reddit, I find hard to believe. But, if you can provide me with some examples that highlight your point of view, I would be interested.

"if you have examples I would be interested" inflates claim without examples
- This whole post just reeks of attention seeking. If they're going to go, they should just GTFO...
You can literally predict the comments on reddit these days before looking. It's the same articles, same top comments, over and over again. You try to be original there and you get down voted. Got to stick to the template and karma can be yours :/
- I always hated that about Reddit; the lack of authenticity. I tried to be my genuine self, and always was downvoted for it. It started to feel like maybe somebody took offense and wrote a bot to follow and downvote everything I posted. Yes, I'm paranoid. :)
- So basically all subreddits are actually sub-subreddits of the subreddit simulator subreddit.
  God I hate that that sentence actually parses and is a thing that makes sense in the English language.
I love how much more international and diverse lemmy is. I'm American, but I am happier with the fact that lemmy isn't 85%+ Americans like on reddit (not a real statistic). I enjoy seeing more content from different perspectives and nationalities.
- Interesting, as an American why did you choose feddit.de?
Density of toxic rhetoric is through the roof on lemmy. It rivals what you'd find on bad private forums of yore.
- Please provide me examples, because as far as I'm concerned, I'm just not seeing the same level of toxicity you are apparently.
- What subs are you in? I can think of a few that are terrible, so I blocked them, and many more where I don't think I have ever seen more than critical opinion.

People are people, no matter where you are.

Yeah I'm sorry. I just don't give a shit about conservative, racist, pro-genocide point of views. I'm going to stick with the human rights, preferred pronouns, and star trek memed Lemmy. This place still has the fraction of users reddit currently has. You have to be patient for the user base to grow if you want more variety.

Look at their profile. If anything, their political views are extreme in a way that fits most of Lemmy.
Edit: Nevermind, check @Stamets

*On the old reddit you mean. Because now its a shitshow.

Why? Honestly asking, it looks the same to me, as if nothing happened.
- You probably not using the official reddit app. But just the lag, the delay, the mega mods, those crazy admins that ban them just by saying there name and just the ammounts of ads, there are just so many karma farmer.

I agree for the most part. Most of the top posts on here are left-wing political posts, where often times center-left views get downvoted to oblivion. Don't even get me started on Hexbear, etc.

I wish we had more people making posts about hobbies and such. c/Linux and a few others are rich in content, but so many others (motorcycles, Factorio, etc.) have very little activity. The hobby subs were my favorite Reddit subs.

I just started a thread on !casualconversation@lemmy.world about communities that people contribute to, feel free to share your own there

Not everyone is here for debate and proselytizing. You want to have debates then go scream at people in the streets with your face visible and within arms length of whomever you're offending. I'm here for fine art, painted miniatures, and owl pictures. Those are procured with civility not dumpster fire opinions.

What about Star Trek memes?
- I'm not personally a fan anymore, but I'm not really a fan of television or movies at this point in my life. I used to watch a lot of NG and DS9 back in the day.
  I do realize that Lemmy does run on Star Trek memes and its absence would be like removing the coal out of a steam engine.
  To answer your question they're not for me, but I do respect the impact ST memes are having.

I’m enjoying Lemmy more than I had enjoyed Reddit in a long time. Like everyone says, however, the niche discussion is the bald patch, that will get better with time.

Looking at your profile and what you post, yeah, you'd like Reddit a lot more.

You’re on the internet arguing politics. You’re only going to be happy in an echo chamber in your favor. Arguing about shit that you’re never going to physically do anything about makes zero sense.

The only interesting Lemmy posts are related to federal politics. The second I open reddit suddenly it's a breath of fresh air.
- Yeah, reinforcing your beliefs in an echo-chamer is comforting, isn't it?

Very much agreed, though I'm not looking to switch back. Reddit had gradually turned into a homogenous slurry of astroturf and toxic groupthink. Lemmy lacks the critical mass for both of these to become a problem.

I still find Lemmy a better alternative, because at least I can see opinions that differ from mine. I'll gladly throwdown and get my opinions challenged rather than feel that I don't need to contribute to a discussion.

Saying that "Lemmy" is an echo chamber is a bit ignorant. Lemmy is a platform; it can he used to spin up an instance with whatever values you like. The fediverse is the same. So saying Lemmy is an echo chamber is a bit like boycotting wood because a politician you dislike stood on a stage to speak.

Having said that, there are instances with heavy political biases. You can block those from your instance and you can block them from you feed.

Lemmy just has an unusually large number of passionate young people on it. Not surprising when you consider the Fediverse as more of a rebellious option looking to upend the dominance of the giants.

Also makes it feisty though. It's kinda on you to make it good for yourself by controlling what communities you sub to though.

If you look at the conservative community, all their posts are downvoted (at least every time I've peeked at it). Same with the Joe Rogan community.
They don't have respite in their own communities on lemmy, due to users browsing all and downvoting their posts.
Maybe on specific instances that cater towards propoganda and extremism, but not on the Fediverse itself.
- I don't think most Lemmy users would support the idea that all ideas and opinions deserve equal consideration, so, yeah, that's going to happen.
  What makes the Fediverse unique is they could actually take steps to stop that if they wanted, by defederating from the higher population Instances. Most services would not give them that option. They have equal right to be here, but that does not amount to equal right to be liked and agreed with.
  That said, I do agree that the downvoting gets a little out of control on here sometimes.
- The thing is that the votes don’t matter on Lemmy, they are purely for organizing content in the home/all feed if you sort by Top. You shouldn’t worry about being downvoted. It doesn’t down rank you in the algorithm and restrict your ability to post like on Reddit.

Ehhh, it kinda depends on where you are on lemmy. The more you're haunting the politically charged communities and instances, the worse it gets.

Outside of those, it varies more. There's usually a fairly echoey vibe to Linux forward thinking, and you'll run into some with fediverse focused discussions/communities regarding social media.

But, if you're hanging around in either niche subject communities, or in the general communities on instances where politics are not a focus, it's way better because you don't have the peanut gallery of randos as often. But even in some of the bigger instances, you can have great discussions with friendly folks easier than on bigger subs.

That's lemmy though, it's smaller, and composed largely of people that think in a general way because lemmy is by nature an "off brand" thing. There's a huge chunk of the user base that left reddit because they got sick of something about reddit. It skews the vibe a good bit. Whether or not any given person likes that is a different issue.

I’ve had trouble getting more niche communities content to appear in my ‘feed’ . example I never see NFL posts unless I navigate to that community. This could be user error but it’s something I’ve had trouble with.
- You aren’t alone. A lot of the sports related communities aren’t heavily upvoted so they won’t usually pop up on the Home/All feeds unless you sort by Rising and happen to browse at the right time. I feel like Lemmy could do well with the ability to create lists like Mastodon so that you could browse certain custom feeds.

I don’t agree with that at all. Just because you don’t agree with the majority opinion doesn’t make it an echo chamber. People downvoting your comment doesn’t make it less valid.

Unlike in Reddit where being downvoted will hide you comment, potentially rate limit you, and users are ranked based on their karma.

There are no algorithmic manipulations on the fediverse. People may not agree with you but they aren’t going to silence you.

The one thing I would agree with you is that there is a segment of neurotic posters that think that instances should defed with any instance that don’t ban users for being conservative because they consider all conservatives to be members of a right-wing hate cult. Those people should not be taken seriously and thankfully the big instances don’t take that approach so you can still have a positive experience on the fediverse without being a communist

So you're not a lefty. Lemmy says: fuck the fuck off you fucking fuck we fucking hate you. Source: left but not left enough.

This depends heavily on the instance. I have consistently received this attitude with users of a couple of specific instances. I now just ignore or instantly block those instance users whenever I see them.
That said. You come to a platform inspired from, designed on, and developed by left progressive ideals. You complain about the left. I can picture the pikachu face you're making right now.
- I get that. It's just amusing that people think open source means free or there is a place where you won't be silenced for dissent. We're human and we will self select for positive feedback. Lemmy is no less a bubble than reddit or xtwitter.

So lemmy is somewhat an echo chamber sure, but I feel if you word it nicely and approach with an open mind you can have really good conversations if you don’t agree with a topic and want to understand more. Whereas on Reddit I find it extremely difficult to have actual conversations

Also sorry for the huge run on sentence

The main problem with it is that there isn't enough users

Unpopular opinion: I hate this argument. At what point is there ever going to be "enough users"? I think that's just an easy cop out used to avoid actually addressing whatever debate you're having. And I mean this with respect.
- There definitely is a critical mass needed for social media. Reddit hit critical mass around 2012 when digg imploded. When I joined reddit in like 2010, it felt very much like Lemmy currently does.
  I think that's a major problem with Lemmy, because it's so disjointed it's hard to hit the critical mass needed to keep conversations interesting and fresh.
I think there are enough, they're just the wrong users.
- I think this comment says a lot, maybe it's you who is the " wrong user"

The niche topics are expanding on the fediverse but it’s not quite there yet.

The general topics on Reddit are full of uninteresting posts and comments. Quality community members have definitely left.

I can’t tell if you think it’s an echo chamber because there are too many like-minded people here, or if your opinions generally fall apart under scrutiny. You may want to evaluate this.

A few topics that can not be discussed on Lemmy unless you agree with the hive mind:

Israel/Palestine

Crypto

Antidepressants

The Death Penalty

Literally anything related to Elon Musk

Hollywood using diversity to hide low quality writing

Modern cars/city infrastructure

(This is not a complete list.)

Hollywood using diversity to hide low quality writing
This is an allowed topic on !movies@lemm.ee, as long as it is part of a discussion thread related to a specific film or show. Feel free to create a thread if the film or show you want to discuss doesn't have one yet.
Don’t forget Apple. Even if you don’t own any Apple products, you have to talk shit about Apple products and anyone who uses them or you’ll lose your Lemmy card. Talking positively about Apple or their products is an immediate downvote and owning one of their products is treason.
- One of the biggest communities on Lemmy is a pro-Apple community. (Shoutout to !apple_enthusiast@lemmy.world!)
Don’t forget Brendan Eich/Brave.

Yes. In addition, there's a lot of hostility towards different viewpoints. Little acceptance that different takes are valid.

I'm not switching back, but I might not stay here either.

That happens in any online space. The internet is not a great place for that kind of discourse because it lacks the context that you have with people that you associate with in real life. When you talk about politics with a family member, coworker, or friend with who you have a disagreement with, you know the experiences that they had in life and led them to hold that belief and so you believe that their viewpoint is genuine and so you look to change their mind. Online the person on the other, you know nothing about so you are more likely to be frustrated with them and consider them a troll or political enemy.
The secret is knowing when to disengage with someone online because otherwise you will get jaded.

You might want to try Hexbear or The_donald if your goal is to discuss "strong president".

Genuinely trying to help you here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_strongman
- You should go live in Russia.

Yeah Lemmy is extremely self-righteous. Though I think they were worse in the early days.

haha never, here you can breath a fresh air of people and freedom, in reddit-twitter you have the freedom that a company "gives" to you. I am in both, but I am more proud to be here than to be on bruhddit.

bye!

Agreed, but(t) fuck Spez.

I see where you're coming from but I also get reddit-ass pandentic arguments here. People downvoting you for posting an unpopular opinion on unpopularopinion is peak reddit as well.

Since I can get the wider reddit experience without spez, I will just stay. I use an alt front to see the smaller communities on reddit once in a blue moon. That's what works for me.

If you join a server that blocks many other instances or have personally block other communities, users or instances, then you are part of the problem.

Is lemmy.world one that illegitimately blocks many communities?
- I think they were mostly reasonable, with some complaints like how they banned piracy communities for a while and also banned/removed a community about magic mushrooms.
  I disagreed with their federating with Threads, so I hopped over onto feddit.de because they are defederated from Threads and tankie instances. That's the beauty of the fediverse tho.
  But you can view the de/federated instances lists for every instance and see if you agree with it. Different apps may have different routes/capability, so I'd recommend opening it in a browser and scrolling to the bottom of the page to find the link: "instances"
  To make it easier for you, here's the instances list for lemmy.world.

Counter points:

On lemmy, using something like thunder or some other client that integrates with a wide swath of the lemmyverse and other things its connected to, you can easily join or leave not just subreddits, but different lemmy instances, which at this stage are often defined by userbases that sometimes have a broad consensus of opinion on certain things, but sometimes dont.

Point 2: Maybe I missed this in reddit, but again using something like thunder, its not too hard to just block people who you witness demonstrate commitment to hive mindedness either in absurd, barely relevant scenarios, or in cases where its obvious the commitment to the hivemind opinion flies in the face of the actual facts of a discussion, or they demonstrate irrationally charged responses to only certain topics which are at best tangentially related to their hivemind triggers, or in cases where their hivemind triggers cause them to misread what was actually typed, assume malice, become irrational, and then refuse to back down after clarification.

Yes this is far from an ideal solution to the hive mind / echo chamber problem, but at least as I am aware, it is /something/ you can do to mitigate the problem, at least for yourself personally, that you cannot do on reddit.

Again though, as reddit has been a sad parody of human discussion for a while now, i have not used it much and may have missed it if you can basically twitter style completely block people entirely from you being able to see them at all, at a client, instead of subreddit moderator level.

EDIT:

To think that you can have a large, popular, diverse interaction with other humans, basically fancy, large forum on the internet without this also including large numbers of people with opinions or rhetoric you personally find objectionable, or who are very confident and very uninformed, is delusionally absurd, any actual objective analysis of the history of basically any large social media app or site or large internet community of basically any kind would evidence this.

This is why i like the blocking ability. Puts power in the hands of the user themself to define their experience.

Is it perfect? Obviously not. Is it better than not being able to do this? Obviously yes.

Can biased people who themselves are very hive mindy use this to put themselves into echo chambers? Yes. It certainly does not solve that problem.

But it does at least allow for more level headed users to choose who they engage with and personally make the call of, ok, this person is wrong, but not in an insane way, maybe theyre worth talking to or seeing further comments/posts from them, vs, nah, this person is obviously toxic and if i dont ban people like that, i am going to suffer mental health problems from seeing deragned nonsense all the time.

Again, anyone whose been in any other large internet community for a while knows that mods are very often lazy, biased, and fall into personal popularity cults / dream worlds, and cannot generally be trusted to be objective, nor reasonably expected to be in a large community where they are basically volunteers, presumably with actual lives and responsibilities when afk.

Yay! So glad you're leaving.

.... e switching _back