Israel will not stop war until Palestinians displaced from Gaza and Syria partitioned, minister says

Eating popcorn. Where are the dems who will fight for their constituents now? Looks like they just nearly unanimously passed a law that will let the administration take down any web content the want, not just revenge porn or deepfakes like they claimed.

So thats the end of free speech. Trump said outright he'd use it to censor his oponents. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/04/congress-passes-take-it-down-act-despite-major-flaws Did the dems just not have time for ammendments?

So was all this trumpery worth it all so the DNC could continue to take AIPAC money?

Or the Laken Riley act passed with dem support.
https://rollcall.com/2025/01/20/democrats-senate-laken-riley-act/ We're deporting anyone now, with democratic party support. They are even trying to use it on citizens. Heck of a job, DNC.

Or when the dems voted to advance trumps budget-- about the only card they had in their hand right now, and they just didnt use it. https://www.newsweek.com/full-list-democrats-voted-trump-gop-spending-bill-2045209

And now you want to what, fingerwag like you have a leg to stand on here? I mean come on man. Show me proof beyond Booker sitting on the steps in theatrical protest that the dems are working some angle thats not just secret support of anything the republicans want?

I guess at least Schumer, who says his whole job is to keep the dems supporting Israel, sent a "very strong letter" to trump. So we have that going for us. https://www.yahoo.com/news/pathetic-critics-cringe-leading-dem-191116497.html

Yay Schumer, way to go.

This is it. Why the fuck is the blame on the people who didn’t vote for a terrible candidate supporting a genocide and not the fucking people supporting the genocide?! Why did the dems all support that censorship bill, when they were initially speaking up about it? Why does it seem like the more exhausted he populace got with trump and his shit, he more democrats seemed to use that as an excuse to start supporting the republicans? Where is all the “stop trump” and “stop fascism” dems now? Why does it seem like they’re done grandstanding about standing up to trump and seem to have rolled over to keep their jobs or whatever it is? Why does this seem all okay, and why is the blame for all of that on people who couldn’t stomach supporting a candidate that was not standing up to a genocide and was parading around the fucking worst of the neocons? Why is it always on the people who didn’t sacrifice their values to once again stomach a candidate that goes against their basic human morals, and not on the politicians continually moving to the right? Why blame the people who see the rightward march of the Democratic Party as a death knell for the country, and not on the people who are fucking marching right as fast as the fascists continue to radicalize? Why the fuck can these assholes not see that we don’t give a shit that you think you’re morally superior to us because you “voted against fascism,” when the party you voted for seems to be actively ushering fascism in through the door?

Where is the fucking class solidarity? These people are selling you out, and you turn to your neighbor to say, “well, you should’ve just voted differently.” We are well beyond this being on us. This is on the people driving the ship, not the ones stuck in the cargo hold screaming that we’re fucking sinking.
Eating ~~popcorn~~ the shit sandwich they helped create. Fixed that for you.
- Good to see "helped" instead of assigned blame. I'll take it.

I voted for Harris, and voted for Biden before that, and Clinton before that. With shame as I should. Harm reduction, methadone instead of heroin.

It's nothing to brag about. You guys try to make them sound like a good choice, when neoliberals are for the same status quo, only minus the scapegoating. They're just a lesser degree of bad. They're for mass homelessness, they're for entire murder for profit economic sectors including American "Healthcare," they're for ever worsening income inequity, because on economic policy (that informs and often dictates social Ills) they're on the same take as Republicans. Just because they don't cheer and pour the blood they're drenched in over their heads in celebration like Gatorade, doesn't mean their hands are any cleaner.

That scapegoating makes Republicans worth voting against, but you're praising Jack the Ripper in the face of Adolf Hitler. No American should feel anything but shame about only having a extreme right wing party and a fascist party as our only two options. No one should have left an American polling place with a smile or pride for the last half century, it's been a rocketship to avarice diseased oblivion, that Trumpism is just a newer symptom of, not the cause.

Reagan toppled this empire, it just takes an empire a while to hit the ground. We have arrived at a while. Trump is more of a vulture come to feast on the corpse.

Probably discussing the latest news about how Biden never pressured Israel for ceasefire

It was just another lie to give political cover as he aided and abetted an ongoing genocide.

Well, at least Joe is out of power, now. Phew! Crisis averted.
- No, Gaza is still being bombed. Children are being intentionally starved. It's still a crisis.
  
  So you’re saying the current president is supporting Genocide? It’s weird, I don’t hear anyone on the left yelling about it. It’s almost like they don’t actually care.
  
  tf? you are the one using this to aire a political grievance.
  
  Dude you're either thinking emotionally or being disingenuous. Take a step back.
  
  I think the word is sarcastic
  
  Yes, the current president is supporting genocide.
  
  You don't hear anyone on the left yelling about it? Maybe you should pay attention, protest movements are ongoing. Protest tactics and media coverage may change in the Trump era, but the anti-genocide movement is still strong in my opinion.
  
  If you want to make some sort of political point then you should come out and say it. Hiding behind sarcasm is off putting when discussing a serious subject like genocide. Its almost like you don't actually care.
  
  We are yelling about it, you aren't listening because you don't actually care and are trying to use this as a "gotcha"
Yeah dude, Biden totally got "political cover" about Gaza.
- Yes, the lie that Biden was pushing for a ceasefire gave him tons of political cover. It was one of his administration's primary Gaza talking points. They used this lie to deflect against valid criticism for months.
  
  Even AOC fell for the lie, saying Harris was working tirelessly for a ceasefire in Gaza

I voted for Harris.

But can you explain exactly how things would have gone differently in Gaza other than the rhetoric if Harris had won? She was all in on the genocide just like Biden, Pelosi, Schiff, etc.

Just because Harris was clearly the better choice overall doesn't mean she (and Biden) wasn't and isn't dead wrong about their fealty to Netanyahu.

My brother in Christ. Israeli officials were literally waiting for Trump to get elected. ~~They KNEW people like you were going to hand them the Gaza Strip. Acknowledge that you fucked up and move on with the rest of us~~.
- Blinken tried to organize for other countries to allow Israel to ethnically cleanse Gaza and those countries to take in the Palestinians in Nov 2023. Then the other countries said "No". The Trump plans of this year arent fundamentally different. They are the same plans as the Democrats under Biden had. Just that Trump is louder about it.
  
  Other countries were waiting for the new administration, since that would signal what our stance was going to be for the next 4 years. It's true that Trump doesn't care about Gaza, but he certainly would like to raze it and build some hotels. At the same time, people stateside might like to protest, but more and more are afraid of being whisked away by plainclothes nobodies to El Salvador. It is possible to say that Harris would not have done a better job stopping the genocide and also that she was still the correct answer.
- I will remind any Democratic supporters of Israel that Israel is in league with Trump. I will not allow them to forget it.
  
  I am most decidedly anti-Israel but voted for Harris due to the dozens of other issues that were different between the 2 candidates.
  
  You and I and millions, I'm sure. But not enough. Even now, as the things he promised he would do come to fruition, people are still just... numb to it.
- What did they do that you consider 'fucking up'?
  
  ~~Decided that abstaining and allowing Trump to be elected was somehow going to help us get more left-leaning politicians?~~
  
  I voted for Harris
  
  Could this be any clearer?
  
  I honestly don’t know anymore what to do with this blue MAGA bs. You can say that you ate Harris out while voting for her but you don’t agree with her pro genocide stance and because you said one critical word they’d still tell you that you made Trump happen somehow?
  
  Hello! I realized I was looking at a different comment chain, which made me think that.
  
  Now:
  
  Basically, what I think needed to happen is a) Harris wins narrowly, and b) we take the energy that people are just now starting to cultivate under Trump (i.e. as he does everything he promised to do and more, for the benefit of seemingly no one but him) and protest because Harris wasn't good enough. Americans cannot keep living in a world where every presidential election is life and death, because that guarantees fascism. The only good thing about what's going on right now is that leopards' faces are being eaten.
  
  I did not want Harris because she wasn't a good enough candidate. Plain as. She was the better of the two candidates we have, but that's simply not good enough anymore. It hasn't been for what, four of the last five election cycles? We need more than two viable candidates (end FPTP), a fragmenting of parties (suicide while FPTP is active), and/or people to wake the fuck up.
  
  So, nothing then, because they didn't do that; they explicitly said, right at the start, that they voted Harris.
  
  You right! I think I was reading someone else's comment.
- I'm neither a man nor a Christian tho.
  
  Cool! People use that as an expression of exasperation.
Doing the both sides thing won’t help here. It distracts from the real problem.
- That isn't both-sidesing.
  
  I said that Harris was clearly better overall. I have a preference and I acted on it, which is the opposite of what both-sidesing is trying to achieve.
  
  However, on the particular issue of genocide in Gaza, I only see differences in rhetoric, not differences in behavior.

Not supporting Genocide Donald.

You say this like Biden was bringing an end to the Genocide.

Trump partaking in Genocide doesn't mean Biden didn't. It was just publicly revealed that Biden never demanded a ceasefire (as if we didn't know that already), Biden sent weapons to Israel to use in their genocidal campaign, Biden sent warships to ward off and defend against any attacks against Israel for their genocidal campaign. Trump doing the same doesn't mean Biden didn't do those things.

You so smugly using Trump's continuation of the genocide as a form of "gotcha" (again, as if we didn't know he would do that) is truly just absolutely morally gross and despicabe.

You deserve Trump.

The Israelis are the one's actually murdering people
- Nobody said otherwise.
- With weapons from multiple other countries who keep resupplying them or giving other political cover to prevent consequences to Israel committing genocide and other preemptive attacks
- The U.S. gov is making sure that no one intervenes and stops them. They are a very direct accomplice.
  
  Without U.S. cover, Israel would get their shit pushed in.
There they are!

You say I deserve Trump… like I’m the one suffering here. Question: do you honestly think Joe Biden would have permitted the removal of all Palestinians from Gaza? Would that even be a conversation right now? How about turning Gaza into a real estate opportunity for the sitting president?

I’m not the one suffering the brunt of consequences for your decision to elect Trump over Biden, it’s the Palestinian people who are. All of you made a choice based on principles that you don’t have the political power to support, and the result is one that is far worse for the actual people affected. That makes the choice morally inferior. And, it’s a shame to see what is happening to the people impacted by it.
- "You say I deserve Trump… like I’m the one suffering here."
  
  If you're American and not ultra-wealthy you are/will be, just like I will.
  
  "Question: do you honestly think Joe Biden would have permitted the removal of all Palestinians from Gaza?"
  
  Yes. Just as he was perfectly fine with them bombing everything from hospitals to schools usimg the weapons he continues to send and using genocidal rhetoric. You would have to be insane to think otherwise.
  
  "Would that even be a conversation right now?"
  
  No. It would just be another day of Joe Biden and the Democrats enabling the genocide while "liberals" sit by and let it happen and calling anyone who opposed it a crazy radical. Just like it was during the year long genocidal campaign he DID engage in.
  
  "I’m not the one suffering the brunt of consequences for your the decision to elect Trump over Biden, it’s the Palestinian people who are."
  
  This is the same blatant denialism of Genocide because Joe Biden was the one doing it I just critiqued.
- Question: do you honestly think Joe Biden would have permitted the removal of all Palestinians from Gaza?
  
  We dont have to wonder. Biden proposed moving the Palestinians to Egypt, at Netenyahus suggestion. Egypt rejected the idea and warned it would shut down relations with Israel if they tried, and then Israel backtracked saying they would never have allowed it anyway because it might permit "terrorists" to return and attack someday.
  
  https://reason.com/2025/01/27/trump-revives-bidens-failed-proposal-to-remove-palestinians-from-gaza/

Surely thrilled that they were able to punish Democrats

I see — As long as the democrats suffer, it justifies the actual genocide that will take place on account of their decision.

It’s good to see the left punishing people who agree with them on 50% of things over people who agree with them on 0% of things. That is a recipe for success. Go team.
- You just had a full back and forth with sarcasm and came away despondent.
- I consider it insult to say I agree with either of our 2 parties on 50% of the issues. Almost all of both of their policy positions are derivations on "how will this metastasize the capital markets faster" and not "how will this improve the wellbeing of the citizens of society, preferably at the expense/taxation of the capital markets that we kindly permit to profit off of society at all so long as they don't undermine said society to increase their profits"
  
  Both parties would be lighting themselves on fire to prevent the latter. The tail has been wagging the dog for a long time, the fucking profoundly perverse servitude of a society to an economy. It obviously needs to be the other way around or... Well this.
- I think the hope is that Democrats will see Israel as being in league with Trump and stop supporting them. Of course given how costly losing this election was, such a strategy would be a Pyrrhic victory even if it were successful. Which is doubtful, given that I view the Democrats as "controlled opposition".

If you can’t stand up against actively supporting an open genocide, you aren’t going to stand up for democracy.

America has been cooked. And yes, Biden is/was complacent

They all realize they were part of a targeted disinformation campaign and regret their life choices.

Tbf though, Kamala could have gotten 4% of inactive voters in 3 key states she could have won. Instead those voters stayed home and now we've got front row seats to the end of an empire

It's not disinformation that Joe Biden enabled and aided the Genocide of Palestinians. Trump doing the same doesn't rewrite history.

Kamala could have gotten all those voters if she just took a stand against genocide.
- I think the thinking was that turning against Israel more publicly would have mostly garnered more entirely worthless votes in states that are already blue and risked losing at risk rust belt states.
  
  If those voters would have been a bit smarter they could have threatened to stay home but actually voted against fascism then continued to petition the incoming regime which unlike Trump isn't actually for genocide. Now there is a good chance for most of those folks you want to save being dead when its possible to reverse course IF its possible to reverse course and we don't have a canceled election and a civil war thereafter.
  
  And they lost with that strategy. So their thinking was clearly wrong, unless they planned to lose.
  
  It's not clear the alternative strategy would have helped AT ALL. A very large portion of Americans actually believed that Trump would either help the economy or help the position of white folks and Christians. Everything else was a side show. That is why they elected him. Things were going pretty good economically before the pandemic and white Christians. That is why we elected essentially Hitler because we are stupid bigots.
  
  Its absolutely clear. If Harris had acknowledging the genocide about 2 weeks before the election would have won over youth, the left, and muslims, which is a vastly larger voting group than the 80% of jewish people who support israel-- or even all jewish voters. Jewish voters are a tiny group-- even just muslim voters are a larger group. Jewish voters arent a compelling voter group, they are a compelling funding group.
  
  But two weeks before the election Harris could have weathered the funding downturn. Her husband would have left her, but no great loss there. Harris could have won.
  
  They were actually for genocide. That's why they partook in an ongoing genocide for over a year. Your entire premise is wrong.
  
  I think the thinking was that turning against Israel more publicly would have mostly garnered more entirely worthless votes in states that are already blue and risked losing at risk rust belt states
  
  That's just not true though. It would have helped across the board but especially in critical swing states
  
  Here Are 34 Polls That Show A Ceasefire & Weapons Embargo Help Kamala Win
  
  Kamala Would Have Won With A Weapons Embargo
  
  The blame is entirely on the campaign for chosing to ignore and even go against those voters instead of make concessions to gain as much votes as possible. They chose to prioritize continuing the genocide over winning against Trump.
  
  Polls have been close not only wildly inaccurate but so incredibly spread out that you could find a few to support literally anyone position after the fact.
  
  That's why it's important to consider how the questions are framed, not disregard polling. And no, the polling methodology used is not wildly inaccurate, what a baseless claim to try to disregard the actual articles.
  
  Progressive policies that a majority of Americans support
  
  Here Are 34 Polls That Show A Ceasefire & Weapons Embargo Help Kamala Win
  
  Kamala Would Have Won With A Weapons Embargo
  
  Democrats' Working-Class Failures, Analysis Finds, Are 'Why Trump Beat Harris'
  
  2024 Post-Election Report: A retrospective and longitudinal data analysis on why Trump beat Harris
  
  How Trump and Harris Voters See America’s Role in the World
  
  Majority of Americans support progressive policies such as higher minimum wage, free college
  
  Democrats should run on the popular progressive ideas, but not the unpopular ones
  
  Here Are 7 ‘Left Wing’ Ideas (Almost) All Americans Can Get Behind
  
  Finding common ground: 109 national policy proposals with bipartisan support
  
  Progressive Policies Are Popular Policies
  
  Tim Walz's Progressive Policies Popular With Republicans in Swing States
  
  It is very very hard to predict who is going to win even when elections that aren't all that close. Asking people how they would behave especially people who didn't even bother to vote is fraught. People who aren't happy about something are apt to say they would do something about it but they showed more about how motivated they are by not even bothering to show up in actual reality. I think anyone who tells you if you did this they would have voted for you is quite frankly full of shit.
  
  White people voted for Trump because they believed they would be privileged. Men voted for him because they believed they would be privileged. Conservatives voted for him because he would appoint conservative judges Financially ignorant people voted for him because he would cut their taxes and encourage business. Republican's voted for him because him being a Republican was far more important than any other factor. Most people who call themselves independent flatter themselves by saying so and in fact vote Red or Blue 95-99% of the time. Those who lean red were never going to vote for a non-white women running under the blue ticket.
  
  None of these factors had anything to do with Israel or Gaza. People in America are selfish and self centered they were never going to vote differently based on Gaza.
  
  Way to ignore both articles that show just how much more support Harris would have gotten by standing by an arms embargo, which is both the popular and morally correct position to have.
  
  Yeah, people in America are selfish. That doesn't change the reality that they recognize those progressive policies are to their own benefit. If you ignore the material conditions of America and have no material analysis of the situation, it's not possible to recognize the root cause of voter apathy and populism, let alone the differences between left populism and right populism
  
  People saying that support when you present them with a moral issue isn't the same thing as them actually turning up to vote. People have all sorts of opinions about what they ought to do and if you ask them if they intend to exercise, floss their teeth, and support the little chidrens in Africa. This doesn't mean they will be doing ANYTHING of note given a chance.
  
  Track actual attendance at gym, check their teeth, and ask for receipts for their donations to feed the starving kids. You'll find that most of them fell short.
  
  I don't care about your opinions. You have nothing to refute the actual articles, you just want to be right regardless of the significant amount of evidence that show you're wrong about public support for a weapons embargo to stop a fucking genocide
- in the grand scheme of voting issues, foreign policy isnt on voters top priority(maybe for michiganers, and whitmers wierdly hanging out with trump awful lot lately), is domestic issues unfortunately. every president had support israel and never once was it the forefront as election issue, until trump wanted to be in power again the MSM started to post pro-israeli propaganda through the airwaves, plus russia early on was fueling the "i am not voting dems for the first ime over this" protests.

Gone.

Their man, Trump, got elected, so they don't need to exist anymore.

I hope your terrorist leaders harris, biden and trump all die lioe fucking pigs.

not being pushed by russian and israeli propaganda through SOCIAL media perhaps.

You mean Schrodinger's Leftists?

Do you think they have the self awareness to even reply to a thread like this?

Right here :)

I voted for Kamala tho