Zelensky says he is unaware of details of Trump plan to end Ukraine war
Zelensky says he is unaware of details of Trump plan to end Ukraine war
President Volodymyr Zelensky said at a news conference at the European Political Community summit in Budapest that he believed Trump wanted to end the war with Russia quickly, but that he had not discussed a plan with him.
I feel so bad for Ukraine more than Americans. The vast majority either voted for him or at least not against him. But the Ukrainians? Them developing nukes seems to be the only way out of this
They had nukes. They got rid of them in exchange for assurances from Russia that they would leave them alone.
It's obviously more complicated than that, but that's essentially what it boils down to.
I think you got that wrong enough it warrants a correction...
They gave them up for assurances that Russia and the USA would protect them if they were attacked.
Edit: that's why the USA is giving them weapons, they're honoring the deal, or at least trying to, not 100% sure on specifics, I'm sure it was vague on what protecting them would entail.
FWIW, my partner is Ukrainian and I asked what's the general mood in the Ukrainian circles. Apparently the unpredictability of Trump is seen as a potential positive. There was quite a lot of disillusionment about the fact that Harris would have continued with the Biden's approach focused on soft politics and weapons given drop by drop.
In fact, the general public was quite unhappy with the cautious american support. If some of the weapons were given much earlier and all at once, the war could now be going very differently.
I don't know if this is now building a narrative that doesn't make you lose hope or if it's the reality. For sure the vibe was for Harris before the elections, but it was definitely as clear cut (due to the above).
If they want nukes, they better get it done before January. Otherwise I can see the future where Zelenskyy is tried in a russian kangaroo court of "Possession of WMDs".
American guy here and I feel similarly. Things are going to get bad for anyone not toeing the party line here soon, but the grunts in the mud just got the worst possible news and that has to be demoralizing.
They housed plenty of nukes for the USSR but can’t build their own (yet).Even if they did it becomes a MAD standoff between them, Moscow and a Moscow friendly USA, which is fucking mind blowing after so many years of the Cold War. I think they’d be better off looking to the EU for jets and artillery to hold the line, I really fear that we’ll start to ship armor to the conscript side not the volunteers.
I'm guessing it's somewhere along the lines of "give Putin what he wants and be grateful". It also wouldn't surprise me if Zelensky isn't exiled or missing sometime next year. I hate it but I've lost all faith.
Because Trump is talking to Putin, not Zelensky. And the plan is “Ukraine loses”.
I saw this as the supposed plan:
per WSJ: It may propose delaying Ukraine's NATO membership for 20 years, establishing a 1,200 km demilitarized zone along the current front line, and leaving 20% of occupied Ukrainian territory under Russian control—while the U.S. would continue arms support under these conditions.
The problem is, this isn't an acceptable plan according to Russia. Russia has insisted that:
- Ukraine retreats from all of the oblasts that are currently partially occupied by Russia (Donetsk, Luhansk, Zaporizhia, and Kherson) as well as giving up claims to Crimea, and Russia takes ownership of everything without a fight
- Ukraine's army is demobilized and Ukraine is demilitarized
- Ukraine is banned from joining any international organization, not just NATO (so no EU for instance)
- Ukraine receives no more military aid fro the west.
Trump is going to find out that you can't unilaterally declare peace.
Trumps plan to end the war? He's going to tell Ukraine to surrender, or the USA will nuke them.
there is no way that would make it look like nukes are going to ukraine and not to russia, so this will trigger launch of russian nukes. congratulations??
Yes. You are correct. This is called sympathetic or preemptive launch and is included in nuclear policy/strategy.
Essentially if you launch something towards the US or especially Russia and people don't believe it's not a nuke they then have to decide if they launch towards the launcher or their closest rival/enemy and those launches trigger other launches.
Most nukes are in known places in hardened bunkers or silos or better at sea in a long haul ICBM sub. If you don't use them you lose them because they're 100% gunna get destroyed if you don't.
Depends on which body of water they launch from.
The plan is “fuck you”.
I can't help but feel we're fucking cooked and Europe is next
Putin certainly is.
There is concepts of a plan