Gaza war protesters shut down Golden Gate Bridge, block traffic in other cities
Gaza war protesters shut down Golden Gate Bridge, block traffic in other cities
Cars were stopped and chains were used to block traffic lanes on the famous bridge. Protesters also blocked traffic in Chicago, New York City and Seattle.
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I have a real problem with this, and I've been on both sides of it. It really doesn't do anything to help your cause by having people stuck in traffic. There are many reasons that someone could be in their car at that moment, not just commuting to or from a job. They could be on their way to a court appointment, they could have dinner in the car, they could be going to pick their child up from school, they could be on their way to a doctor's appointment, or any of a million other reasons that make this not just an inconvenience, but a complete shithead thing for someone to put someone else through. Protestors aren't making their case against the war by pissing off every person stuck in traffic, they are just being dickheads. If you want to protest a war, go hang out outside of a government building, or in front of an elected official's house. Make them feel uncomfortable, not some poor schmuck who has somewhere else to be at the moment.
Edit: Ok, I guess I need to give a peaceful example. You want to block traffic? Block the exits to the parking garage where the elected officials park downtown. Do that for a week and see how much of an impact you make. Blocking commuters is a waste of energy.
I don't think the goal is to convince the people stuck in the artificially created traffic about Gaza. I think it's to get news coverage from sites like nbcnews.com so as to raise the profile of the Gaza war so that politicians must address it. You are welcome to argue whether that's an effective strategy, but I think that's the intent.
Also, side note.. Social progress rarely comes from rule following.
Is the profile not high enough? I'm pretty sure everyone knows about it who needs to know about it. Blocking traffic isn't going to make a ceasefire happen across the world. Annoying your fellow citizens and ruining their day isn't getting any politicians to act. It's pointless. Actions must be taken against those in charge if we want to see any forward progress. Blocking traffic to protest a war is like yelling at a frycook because you want the McRib back. The actions are being aimed at the wrong people.
counterpoint: the people who would enact this change are far beyond our reach as citizens so there is no way to target them with effective protests.
Besides, some of the best way to affect policy is to A. Cost large businesses money or B. To cause general unrest over an issue. Both of these things will piss your fellow American off but this is how protests work nowadays.
I think most protestors don’t want to block cars of normal people or throw paint onto paintings or whatever. But they have to because if you look at the laws, organized protest has no bite anymore. Go ahead, annoy the politicians, they’ll just arrest your outside of their house and no one will hear about your issue.
That's the problem. No one is actually doing anything worthwhile. You are right, standing outside the mayors house will get you arrested. Do it anyway. Get arrested. You want to make big moves for your cause, do something worth being arrested over. Imagine if all of those people on the bridge yesterday had been blocking traffic to the mayors neighborhood instead. What are they gonna do, arrest a thousand people in a suburb street? That's a fucking news story. Blocking a bridge is bullshit, it carries no weight because there is nothing on the line. Congrats, you fucked up a half million people's day, I guess someone should call the genocide off, now.
What do you mean it carries no weight? That was my entire point. Make the public mad, the angry public starts yelling at the mayor. The business owners whose workers can’t get to the office start getting rather upset. Whereas if a minority inconvenience a politician, cool, but they don’t care. They will just find ways to avoid it. And in this case, you don’t have access to politicians that hold weight in regard to Gaza.
Go ahead, egg your senators house, they don’t live there most of the time. Threaten to vote them out, they run unopposed. The ways in which to express political efforts is now so narrow that stuff like blocking a bridge has become almost inevitable.
I do not think we live in the same world, where someone being late to their job will make the business owner consider political change.
counterpoint: the people who would enact this change are far beyond our reach as citizens so there is no way to target them with effective protests
Literally go to the capitols instead. Or go to their houses. Some place that actually effects them rather than complete laymen.
Seriously! Protesting has never accomplished anything ever and is totally useless unless it's done explicitly for politicians that are totally receptive and eager to assist their constituents!
I think it’s to get news coverage from sites like nbcnews.com so as to raise the profile of the Gaza war so that politicians must address it.
Right... because the global leaders of the world aren't already aware of what's going on. Thanks for raising awareness, guys.
It's about the public discourse. If an issue (e.g. the U.S. giving Israel weapons and enabling their war) disappears from the headlines, it's much easier for politicians to ignore it. But if the issue keeps coming up, politicians feel pressure to act--or they risk getting voted out of office. Especially during an election year.
They're not in front of the White House, they're not even in front of city hall, they're hurting their own.
The King loves it when the peasants fight amongst themselves.
They're hurting commuters from Marin county lmao. They're not fucking peasants.
As a peasant who used to spend a lot of time in Marin for work, I’m not sure what you mean by this.
That's a personal problem. The demographics and political power of Marin county residents are public knowledge. I live/work in Marin county and the vast majority of residents are extremely wealthy. There are exceptions, but, as one of those exceptions, I can understand why they are blocking the golden gate bridge and won't get pissy at a group of people who have made national news with their courageous protest against genocide.
I mean, the definition on Google is:
peasant (n.): a poor farmer of low social status who owns or rents a small piece of land for cultivation (chiefly in historical use or with reference to subsistence farming in poorer countries).
I'd assume they just aren't familiar with how you're using it
They arnt the ruling class, they are peasants and you are just angry at someone with a different outlook at you, assigning them ruling class because they dont have the exact same problems you do. this is exactly what they want you to do, attack and hate on your countrymen instead of the ruling class.
They actually are the ruling class. Seriously, look at the demographics.
Yes, look at the demographics. it is not senators and billionaires, just because these people are better off than you are I does not make them the enemy. This is the entire gameplan, you hating on people who make more than you instead of the people who are in control.
They are billionaires and multimillionaires, owners of huge corporations. It's one of the wealthiest counties in one of the wealthiest states. Not sure if any in particular are senators, but there are powerful people.
If you work or live there, you are there. you are inconveniencing your people. are you a millionaire?
Not sure if you are agreeing with me or not, but that is exactly what I'm saying. Right now, blocking traffic is about as easy for the "king" to ignore as anything else.
I feel bad for the people in traffic but the protestors only get to this state because of repeatedly being ignored by the government. If normal protests aren’t cutting it anymore and you don’t want to be violent then what options do you really have? They (gov) just don’t listen.
Protest where it is effective, not where it gets you the most social media clout. Blocking traffic is the protesting equivalent of a selfie. Make some noise near an elected official, and often. See how quickly they change their attitude when they are the ones being fucked with.
Obviously they tried that to the tune of deaf ears.
I would love to know what Universe you live in where quiet polite demos in out of the way places get reported on the news and come to the attention of all the other 334,912,895 people in the US that didn't see it personally.
Oh, you're right. I forgot the real point of protesting. I've been living my life thinking it's a public demonstration designed to let those in power know you are dissatisfied with how things are happening. Now I understand, though. It's performance art for the last stay at home mom in Michigan who hasn't heard about the war. We gotta get her to stop making that mayonnaise salad and start an aluminum drive for the war effort. Thanks for clearing it up. If I ever have a problem with anything in the future I'll know not to go to the person in charge, I'll just run into traffic and shake my ass at onlookers until the world changes for me. That's gonna make things a lot easier from here on out.
Were you born yesterday?!
Because only somebody born yesterday would believe those in power in a trully Democratic nation (much less America, which is a Power Duopoly system, not a genuine Democracy) would care in any way form or shape with the concerns expressed by a few thousand people demonstrating politelly in an out of way place where their polite "expression of concern" did not even made the News.
If you're lucky (in the US, you have to be very, very, VERY lucky), they might care about not losing the votes needed to keep on being elected, which in a country of more than 300 million people means caring about Public Opinion, not about politelly expressed concerns of a few thousand demonstrators that the rest of Americans aren't even aware off and who clearly if their concerns aren't addressed won't do anything more than politelly demonstrate in a way that the politicians can carry on safelly ignoring forever.
Are you even old enough to understand that mere Passive Agressiveness doesn't actually work as a means to get your way with people who have way more power than you do and don't know you well enough to empathise with your (or who are just sociopaths, so wouldn't care even if they did know you)?!
It's quite extraordinary how when it comes to Politics in America there is this abundance of brainwashed unthinking drones spreading the idea that the only way to improve America is to keep on pulling your pants down and saying "Give it to me big boy!" whenever an American politician does something people disagree with, or maybe bark loudly but never bite, just like puny dogs like chiwuawas do.
Are you even old enough to understand that mere Passive Agressiveness doesn’t actually work as a means to get your way with people who have way more power than you do and don’t know you well enough to empathise with your (or who are just sociopaths, so wouldn’t care even if they did know you)?!
you definitely arnt old enough to know that it actually has gotten results. Worldwide. Mahatma Gandhi? segregation sit ins? white feather movement of the UK? and these are only off the top of my head.
Its quite extraordinary how when it comes to Politics in America, there is this abundance of brainwashed unthinking drones spreading the idea that the only way to improve America is to keep on dragging down others and saying "Why arnt you fixing this for me?" whenever an American politician does something people disagree with, or maybe bark loudly but never bite, just like puny dogs like chihuahuas***** do.
Oh right, the countless Revolutions that came about by not causing any bother to anybody. How could I forget those.
By the way you might want to read more about Ghandi if you think all he did was not bother anybody.
lol, Revolution. good job moving goal posts. apparently blocking traffic is now the first step to a violent overthrow of the sitting government.
Sure, tell me all about Gandhi and how he drug down those around him like a crab in a bucket, i'll read your sources since you thats your cherry picking.
I think you may have responded to the wrong person...
You should read some history and stop acting so juvenile. Peaceful non disruptive protests never accomplished shit. People died for women’s right to vote, they died for civil rights, and they died for the five day work week. A one day shutdown of a bridge is fucking nothing compared to what went down with those movements.
This is democracy at work. Liberals are all the same, pro-democracy until it gets in their way or upsets them. You don’t change power structures by asking politely.
I think you replied to the wrong person...
Protest where it is effective
That being where...?
In some fat elected officials face. Probably about as far away from all of those people stuck in traffic as they can be.
Non-responsive.
Give a specific answer, not vague bullshit.
Find an elected official. Follow them to where they are meeting their mistress for a meal before heading to a hotel to fuck. Call the boys. Protest outside of the restaurant so the news is sure to catch the congressman running around on his wife. Make it inconvenient to be a lawmaker. Is that specific enough for you?
They just told you. At the politician not in the road like a coward who didn't get enough attention when they were a kid
It’s not going to get the government to listen by doing this either. It’s completely ineffective and just pisses people off and actively stops them from supporting a cause.
/agree
I fully support the cause, but this just ain't the way to effectively protest the system. I feel the same way about the climate activists throwing soup on art instalation (yes I know they are all protected, but to the average person you still look like an ignorant fucking asshole).
If you want to spur change, then you need to make it uncomfortable for your representatives to take a public position than conflicts with your ethics. Do so peacefully, but forcefully and as often as is feasible. You are much more likely to garner public support that way, and normies generally love anything that make politicians look bad.
Why peacefully? Just today the IDF attacked a playground with an airstrike killing a group of children playing in broad daylight. It would be unbelievable if there wasn't clear footage of it and numerous similar attacks. US supplied weapons, funded by our taxes, cheered on by our political establishment. Stopping traffic isn't going nearly far enough.
The paintings were an amazing protest. Also love the protests interrupting plays. Meet complacent liberals at their stomping grounds.
The paintings were an amazing protest.
As a way to garner media exposure, sure. But not as a way to galvanize public support, which is what actually matters unless you are just interested in performative virtue signaling.
Also love the protests interrupting plays. Meet complacent liberals at their stomping grounds.
You seem like you care more about generalizing people, and antagonizing them than actually changing their minds. So, thank you for further reinforcing OP's initial point I guess...
Thoughts and prayers for Gaza y'all
Another way of saying bullying. There is a reason why the protestors aren't blocking Sturgis.
Every bully is smart enough to punch down. So they go to places full of people who basically agree with them and wreck their day instead of doing the hard thing and dealing with people who don't agree with them. You think you are being clever but it is just being cowardly.
waaaaaa I had to wait in traffic while children are starving in Gaza, due to the U.S.-backed military actions waaaaa 😭😭😭
Two wrongs == right
Can't wait to see your cooler better protests!!! Thanks for volunteering!
Hmm?
you have so many opinions on what an effective protest is, go do them! can't wait to hear about them on the news! unironically, go do it!
No. I am under no obligation to do that.
Yeah, I kinda thought that the backlash to those ones was mostly from people who weren't going to give a fuck anyways. If throwing soup on the glass that protects the mona lisa, or interrupting a play, is higher on tje chopping block than the actual issue at hand, then that's not the kind of person that was generally going to help anyways. Didn't understand the scale of the problem, might have agreed with you in principle or in spirit but realistically was going to do jack shit all to advance your cause, etc. Oh no! Whatever will they do next? Walk around naked? Put hot sauce packets underneath the toilet seats of city hall? Anybody seriously outraged at what is basically just some light politically-motivated ribbing needs their priorities rearranged, because shit is going to/needs to change much more for, you know, change to occur.
Yup, exactly. If you're more pissed off at your play being disrupted than you are at an ongoing genocide, your priorities are fucked and you deserve to be inconvenienced until you finally come to Jesus (metaphorically) and take action. The people going to art museums and plays, drivers coming from Marin county ... these people generally are from a high socioeconomic class and absolutely have power to speak up and make change.
Yeah. I saw some of the posts across Lemmy trying to organize this.
There it was presented as blocking shipping ports. I thought that was odd. Wasn't sure how that was going to affect Israel, but whatever.
Then the day comes and they're doing this low effort reposting-of-a-meme-everyone-has-seen-already version of protest and I just rolled my eyes.
"Innocent people are being murdered in Palestine, so I'm going to go prevent someone that also hates what is happening from visiting their dying grandmother! That'll show 'em!"
🙄
This comment is so meta. You're literally engaging in the conversation about it right now. This means it worked... How does no one understand this? The fact of the matter is it makes the issue relevant so that it shows up on people's screens and they're forced to confront the issue and debate the protest and it becomes topical. No one wants to be stuck in traffic. I sympathize with those who were affected. But I'll give you one guess who I sympathize with more right now.
Protesters were blocking ships that were sending weapons to Israel. You wouldn't like any form of protest because YOU DON'T CARE
Please shut up. You have no idea whether they care or not.
Their dismissive attitude towards people protesting a genocide paints the whole picture. Learn to interpret the ideologies behind what people say.
Your 'interpretations' are just whatever best fits the narrative you've made up in your mind.
Cool story bro!! So cool that the anti-protestor commenter is actually probably some amazing anti-genocide-in-gaza activist!!! I'm sure they have made national news with their protests!
-Nationally Recognized Activist, Whoreticulture.
I'm out here supporting and sharing the actions of people doing protesting the ongoing genocide, not putting them down like you. Not pretending I could do something better. I think they did a great job.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/gaza-detainees
Educate yourself on what's happening! Israel has concentration camps and they are routinely amputating the prisoners due to shackling-related injuries.
Protesters were blocking ships that were sending weapons to Israel.
Link? Because that would be a high quality protest I could get behind.
That's not what the posted article is about, though. The posted article Is about protesters just blocking traffic. That's what I was commenting on.
Any small group of dingbats can block traffic for a while. What they never seem to understand is that this kind of low effort protest doesn't help their cause.
When you're disproportionately affecting innocent people, many of whom may actually agree with your broader message, all you do is piss people off.
Blocking innocent people from getting where they're going to protest something they had nothing to do with is just a kinder gentler version of bombing an apartment building and killing innocent people just because some militants are allegedly also in the building. They're both great ways to convince people that you're a shitty human being, but that's about it.
Not even going to bother to address your shitty anti-protest takes, lots of others have done so in other comments.
Completely agree. Blocking the average Joe driving home will get attention, but potentially for the wrong reason. I think your edit is perfect. Inconvenience those in power that can do something about it now, not someone who can really only do something when voting.
The objective is to appear in the News, which will result in way more people becoming aware of just how many people are against what Israel is doing in Gaza and the US Administration's support of it, which in turn will lead others to become more open about they themselves being against it since they will feel that "we are many" rather than "it's just me" - grassroots movements independent of established politicial and media networks, no matter how many potential supporters they have, must be seen in order to grow otherwise they'll just fizzle away and nothing will change.
That usually means some kind of stunt in an important and highly public place which is almost certain to affect lots of members of the public.
Barelly disturbing a handful of politicians as you suggest would not make the News unless the Press was already there for some other reason and it would still have to be some kind of stunt (think the Iraqi guy that threw his shoe at George Bush) for the Press to even mention it in the news.
Unfortunatelly in the World we live in people have to use marketing strategies to merelly be seen, more so to have soap box to be heard by the rest of the nation, especially in Theatre Of Democracy countries were the "choice" is either pre-selected A or pre-selected B, and were the Press is not at all a Pillar Of Democracy independent of the Political Pillar but is pretty much joined at the hip with Political and/or Wealth Powers.
If it had the kind of Political and Press environment were those things could just be done the way you naivelly (or maybe misleadingly) suggest, the US would be quite a different place in terms of Power, Voice and Representativeness and not one where the only electoral "choice" is between two genocide-loving presidential candidates.
Media attention is a failed outdated tactic.
The proposal states that in each city, we will identify and blockade major choke points in the economy, focusing on points of production and circulation with the aim of causing the most economic impact, as did the port shutdowns in recent months in Oakland, California and Melbourne, Australia, as just a few examples.
Hurting the rich's pocket books is the only language they respect. Now I'm not sure blocking roads is the most effective form of this tactic. Usually you use labor unions. But they're probably just working with what they have.
Why not both?
Media attention is a consequence of success that activists mistake for success itself. If you start seeking it out you'll get caught in the trap of trying to control how the networks present you when you can't control the networks at all. Pretty soon you're doing useless shit like trying to levitate the Pentagon. Or worse, volunteering to get arrested en-masse.
That usually means some kind of stunt in an important and highly public place which is almost certain to affect lots of members of the public.
Yeah, but you're not getting public support. You're getting the opposite.
Those poor schmucks also have a voice and have political power. And you can't deny the optics of the Golden Gate Bridge being closed, it's an iconic throughway. I'm not sure if there are any instantly recognizable parking garages.
So, some single mother in the Midwest is now going to do something about Gaza now? That's what we needed? Optics? Fuck. We should put up some billboards along the interstate next, that'll bring all this kids back from the dead
You all are missing then ENTIRE FUCKING POINT of a protest. It isn't to block traffic, it's to force action to be taken where none is, and no one capable of taking that action gives two squirts of chipotle if some people stood on a bridge yesterday. Fuck with the establishment, make some cunt in his comfortable office sweat.
If you knew anything about the SF Bay area, you would understand who this protest is targeting. Those people absolutely have power to influence change.
I actually wrote a very long reply to this, but then I checked your comment history, and I thought I'd be more supportive.
Look, one day, everything is going to change. Maybe not all in one day but it'll be quick. Something will happen, and you'll have to re-evaluate the way you look at the world. When that happens, take three deep breaths. Hold them. Eventually you'll pass out, and you'll be doing everyone around you a favor by not talking for however long you are unconscious for. Hopefully you'll drop your phone and it'll break, and you can take a break from social media, too.
maybe someday you'll learn that genocide is wrong and protesting it is always morally good!!
Ahh yes, I believe the old saying goes something like, "Always take the moral high ground, no matter how many people you have to step on to get there."
Pretty much yes? If you were in Nazi Germany you'd have to step on a lot of complacent liberals to stay morally conscious. Same thing going on here, with you.
"this guy disagreed with me, better liken him to a nazi"
The comparison is apt due to the ongoing genocide. He is the one saying that a stance against genocide is some sort of unwanted moral high ground. Not sure how being committed to morality is a bad thing.
Wow! You should have just not replied at all! This is worthless condescending garbage!
It's so easy to complain about people protesting genocide when they stop you from going to work to fund the genocide.
Who else is gonna make the ladders for you to climb off your horse with?
I'm also funding public roads and schools and cancer research and fire departments. If you care that much, go to DC and protest. They obviously are able to take time off of work as it is.
You got it man random people driving in San Francisco are personally propping up the genocide well done
What is an economy?
This a pretty bad take, and I fucking applaud what the protesters are doing.
What is an economy?
I knew I forgot to pay my genocide bill this month.
I surely do not spend money on living expenses. Just genocide.
I see you don't understand the point of protesting.
And that you don't know how to protest effectively.
Convenient protests don’t do shit. They get ignored, and often not reported on at all.
People said exactly the same thing you’re saying about the civil rights movement. Which was much more disruptive than the schoolbooks teach.
I dunno I mean I would normally oppose this on principle, but I do kind of agree. This does stop all local traffic at the golden gate bridge, but it doesn't really do anything to incentivize that politicians controlling the funding of israel at (mostly) the federal level to change course. Unless we maybe saw floyd-level protests happening across the nation, or something. This specific kind of protest is most effective when addressing local or state level problems, because local or state level leaders are more easily strongarmed, especially as they're about to pass bad legislation. The threat of further property damage can be used as leverage which can influence local decisions. Local protests are better used against local targets, and target selection is crucial, basically, though that applies more to mass protests, this seems more like a smaller group.
It probably would've been better to go after a lockheed martin facility, or something to that effect, but obviously that comes with a much, much greater deal of risk. Probably the softest points to push on would be something like a higher-up, or the infrastructure going into and immediately around a facility, especially with such a small group. It's not as though the locations of weapons manufacturers aren't publically known, or accessible, or that there aren't many different, small, critical pieces, including people, that go into the manufacture of advanced weaponry.