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debate
  • Yes I can!

  • Asa has a fancy box
  • That's how I wake up in the morning

  • What is so good about sync (and the other interfaces)?
  • Have you looked through the Sync settings menu? You can customize A LOT about the UI look and feel, including card type, card information, text size, text font, etc.

  • Feature suggestion: duplicate posts handling
  • Have the various comment threads on a carousel once you click in. Because of the fractured nature of Lemmy servers I feel like I see way more reposts than on Reddit. It would be nice for them to get merged in some way.

  • Appreciation post for Liftoff not collecting user data or injecting ads.
  • Because people have run analysis on the activity of the app already and the trackers don't fire if you aren't on the ad supported version.

    All of the listed stuff is also required for serving ads through services like Google and pretty normal for ad-supported apps.

  • What do you mean "personal carbon footprint" was a red herring pushed by BP to direct attention away from systemic policy solutions??
  • It's not about that. It's about actually trying to solve the problem which we know from hundreds of years of history, almost always has to happen at the governmental level

  • Appreciation post for Liftoff not collecting user data or injecting ads.
  • The data privacy stuff is all related to the plumbing required to serve ads.

    If you pay for the ad-free version none of that stuff gets loaded.

  • Appreciation post for Liftoff not collecting user data or injecting ads.
  • Sync just added an option for that.

  • *Permanently Deleted*
  • We as a society have already said that we don't allow children to make their own decisions, so any trans-related care falls under that banner and is, like any major medical procedure, already incredibly difficult for minors to get approved for. If you feel that we should be legislating beyond the practices of the medical community and the FDC, then yes that will carry a high bar of medical knowledge I'm going to ask you to have, as you are advocating for knowing better than the field of medicine as a whole.

    There are still strict medical guidelines that doctors have to follow, even on an individual level. The story I hear over and over again from trans people is "it was a nightmare getting approval for my care and it took years" not "it was super easy".

    My question will always be: why is trans care special? We already have lots of rules around medical care for children. Why does trans care need to be specifically singled out?

  • *Permanently Deleted*
  • If you passionately believe that you should be allowed to make medical decisions for someone else instead of their doctor, that you know better than the medical community, you better fucking be able to answer the precise medical reasoning behind it.

    My worldview on abortions and transitioning is easy: that's a personal choice between an individual and their doctor. It doesn't affect the health of anyone but the person getting the procedure so I, but anyone else, should have a say.

    I don't need in-depth medical knowledge to defend that position. If you're position is that we should go mucking about in other people's care, you do need to know the medical particulars for why you believe that or I'm going to judge you hard.

  • Nvidia released a paper about a 100KB text-to-image model that only trained for 4 minutes but claims to be better than bigger models
  • NVIDIA's marketing overhypes, but their technical papers tend to be very solid. Obviously it always pays to remain skeptical but they have a good track record in this case.

  • Good news!
  • Yeah I'm not saying they're going to change. I'm saying they're stupid.

  • Won't someone think of the hate speech!?
  • There's no way the EFF wouldn't step in and help with legal bills if they needed to.

  • Good news!
  • And not caring makes them kinda dumb and short-sighted in the big picture.

  • Good news!
  • I've watched that before. It's not that I don't understand why it happens. It's that said playbook has obvious shortcomings in modern society that the up putting those in power in a worse condition.

    I stand by my station my assertion that hording wealth to that degree is just stupid and short-sighted. It lowers the chances that advances the wealth holder would benefit from will happen in their lifetime.

    This video on egotistic altruism covers it pretty well.

    The more you give, the more your bowl will be plentiful.

  • 12.3 Billion Miles Away: NASA Has Lost Communication With Voyager 2 Spacecraft
  • Precision for what? Knowing their cron job will fire? Knowing what was wrong with the commands they sent? Neither of those are crazy precise or ambiguous statements?

    The only highly precise thing that needs to happen is the alignment of the antenna but that system has been working for decades already and has been thoroughly tested.

    NASA tends to be pretty straightforward when talking about risks, and if they feel like all the systems are in working order and there's a good chance we'll be back in contact with it, I think it's worth talking them at their word.

    Like yeah, it's impressive they can aim an antenna that precisely, but using stars to orient an object is a very very well understood geometry problem. NASA has been using that technique at least as far back as Apollo

  • Good news!
  • But it can be removed as a possibility by circumstance, which is what this comic is getting at.

  • Good news!
  • Because by limiting access to those resources, they can't be used in ways you wouldn't expect.

    Sure, you might invest in cancer research. But did you back the right horse? Soon enough? What about the person who would have engineered earlier detection if they had gone to grad school, but the resources that could have been used to provide that are tied up in your net worth?

    No concentrated approach will ever have the same results as letting millions of extra people work on their millions of ideas. The chances of someone hitting on something that sticks increase dramatically with the number of people throwing shit against the wall.

  • Good news!
  • This is why, in my opinion, billionaires are incredibly stupid.

    By hoarding wealth and forcing people to live paycheck-to-paycheck, with little-to-no time for self improvement or leisure. With few resources to devote towards education or career-building, you are strangling the pool of people who could make your life better. Who could find the cure for whatever illness finally gets you. Who could invent something you'd never have thought of that will improve your quality of life.

    Before the pace of modern technology I can kind of get the impulse, but modern billionaires are operating on rules of 'how to win' from 100 years ago. They are -- by any metric -- not only socially backwards, but fundamentally stupid. They are too dumb to even get being greedy right.

  • 12.3 Billion Miles Away: NASA Has Lost Communication With Voyager 2 Spacecraft
  • Lol. The knee-jerk contrarianism online really gets under my skin, especially when it's towards experts.

    Like yeah, sometimes experts are wrong or systems don't behave as expected. But framing that as some sort of erudite insight really bugs me.

    "I hope the recovery system works!" doesn't need to be rewritten as "Mmm yes. But what these engineers haven't considered is the possibility that they are wrong".

  • With Meta exploring the fediverse, would it be possible to create a copy-left federation license to block for-profit entities from federating with a server?

    I.E. a way to legally enforce that servers which federate with you are not allowed to serve ads alongside content from your server, and must be run by not-for-profit entities?

    I'm curious about some sort of strategy that blocks Meta from extracting money from the content creators in the current fediverse by using legal licensing of some sort, similar to how the GPL software license requires any derivative software to be open source.

    14
    [Wheel of Time] Padan Fain is our biggest window into the Creator's mind
    kbin.social [Spoilers All] Padan Fain is our biggest window into the Creator's mind - Wheel of Time discussion - kbin.social

    Figured I would start moving over some of my high effort posts to the fediverse. This is a post I originally made on the /r/wot and then posted to books@kbin.social. Hope it's all right that I'm re-posting here....

    [Spoilers All] Padan Fain is our biggest window into the Creator's mind - Wheel of Time discussion - kbin.social

    Cross-postong from https://Kbin/m/wheeloftime

    ⚠️⚠️ FULL SERIES SPOILERS ⚠️⚠️

    0
    Books @kbin.social zalack @kbin.social
    [Wheel of Time] A Failure of Both Halves: How the mistakes of the Second Age are avoided in the Third

    Cross-postong from https://Kbin/m/wheeloftime

    ⚠️⚠️ FULL SERIES SPOILERS ⚠️⚠️

    0
    The recurring theme in Adrian Tchaikovsky's works is "what if ___ was sapient?"

    (spoilers for the premises of various books)

    Children of Time: What if spiders were sapient?

    Children of Ruin: What if octopi were sapient?

    Children of Ruin (again): What if slime mould were sapient?

    Children of Memory: What if raven couples were sapient?

    The Final Architecture: What if moons were sapient?

    Dogs of War: What if networks of sapients were sapient?

    Bear Head: What if Trump were sapient?

    12
    Arcane is a masterclasses in how to mine for drama and surprise in genuine human interaction rather than miscommunication, forced conflict, or contrived choices.

    Moving some of my higher quality posts over from Reddit. Originally wrote this for /r/Arcane

    ⚠️⚠️ FULL SERIES SPOILERS AHEAD ⚠️⚠️

    Original Post ----------

    One of Arcane's achievements is it's ability to not reach for cheap drama, which I find especially refreshing in a fantasy context. There were a lot of moments where Arcane geared itself up to do The Dramatic Thing™ and then subverted it, not by doing The Dark Thing™, or the Out of Left Field Thing™, but by doing the human thing instead.

    Examples:

    • Mel not being a Femme Fatale. She genuinely wanted what was best for the people and respected Jayce. I thought for sure she was just using him, and I'm sure it started that way, but they really developed their relationship in a beautifully natural way so there's no Moment™ where she either sees him for the first time and totally changes or betrays him.
    • Powder overhearing Mylo vent to Vi about her and leaving before Vi takes her side. They talk it out later that night and reach an understanding.
    • Powder and Vi's reunion. They just hug and share a genuine moment before their differences begin to manifest.
    • Vander's tough but supportive reaction to the failed job. He uses it as a teachable moment for Vi, and Vi takes the feedback rather than it being a well you're not my real dad moment. We get to learn a lot about the trust and care these characters have for each other.
    • Vi and Caitlyn cooperating with each other right out of the gate, resolving differences as they come up in good faith (even when heated) rather than constantly being at each other's throats the way most shows would do. Storytelling, as a craft, has an obsession with conflict. Almost all works on how to tell stories focus on how to craft good conflict. And yes, every story needs good a central tension (which Arcane has in spades), but Arcane shows that moments of cooperation can be just as dramatic as conflict, and isn't afraid to let it's characters find ways to come together as a way to mine drama.

    I can't think of a single contrived dramatic beat. There's no forced misunderstandings or characters overreacting. It lets the drama flow from the characters and their choices, rather than a contrived situation they are being put into. It forces the show to dig deep and find the things the characters truly care about so it can push those buttons.

    Silco's genuine care for Jinx and his people underneath how abusive and shitty he is for both is another great example. Most villains -- even when given a good motivation and philosophy -- feel Evil™, like the philosophy they are espousing is more an excuse to be cruel, or is a purposefully twisted misreading of a moral precept to justify and deflect their actions; the fiction needs to prove to you that they deserve their demise. Arcane manages to give it's villain an actually noble goal of freedom for his people and lets him genuinely believe in it while he paves his way to hell.

    No moment of tragic redemption, either, where he repents his choices and accepts the moral of the story into his heart. Arcane mines it's characters for additional depth instead of changing who they are. Character arcs, while strongly present, are just as often a study in revelation as change. Silco's moment of crisis when he is asked to give up Jinx is used to reveal another layer, rather than change what we've already seen. The show isn't afraid of making us feel for it's villain without changing him. His evil is able to be the best he is capable of for who and what he cares about.

    Silco is such a great villain: A man forged by the cycle of violence who can only love and care in toxic ways. He's both awful and tragic. A choice that genuinely surprised me: In act 2 I thought for sure he was going to betray Jinx and reveal she was just a tool to him, only to be changed in some moment of connection. Instead -- again -- there is no Moment™ where he either gives into his evil completely or repents to the light. He is a consistent, contradictory human to the end: genuinely ruthless, genuinely caring, genuinely idealistic, and genuinely cynical to his last breath. The scene of him agonizing over his situation at Vander's statue isn't one of a crisis of choice, but a crisis of acceptance. He is lamenting what's important to him. We get to see a beautiful moment of self reflection and sorrow because Arcane echews the normal cheap conflict many shows would grasp for: drawing out the suspense of what Silco will do to mine for drama. Instead, Arcane mines the acceptance of his inability to choose anything else.

    Even between adversaries there is often a deep respect and/or complex history that isn't just boiled down to a single feeling. Silco vs Vander. Ekko vs. Jynx, Jayce vs Victor, Mel vs her mother, Marcus vs Grayson. All these relationships have a rich interpersonal interaction that never makes it feel like they are completely at odds, even when they are in each other's way.

    Sevika, who is set up to be super jealous of and frustrated with Powder has that "She'll come to you when she's ready" moment with Silco; we learn SO MUCH about her character in such a small interaction. We get to see her in a redeeming moment of reassurance, where many shows might twist the knife a bit with a catty line because well, she doesn't like Jynx.

    Instead, Arcane chooses to let us see over and over that while there might be an overriding top layer to a character or relationship, moments of deeper layers peeking through are where the real story lies.

    3
    Books @kbin.social zalack @kbin.social
    [Wheel of Time] Sai-dim and Sai-dumb: The Parable of Gawyn and Galad

    Cross posting from https://kbin.social/m/wheeloftime

    ⚠️⚠️ FULL SERIES SPOILERS ⚠️⚠️

    0
    [Wheel of Time] We are meant to be sickened by Tylin

    Figured I would start moving over some of my high effort posts to the fediverse. This is a post I originally made on the /r/wot and then posted to books@kbin.social and wheeloftime@kbin.social. Hope it's all right that I'm re-posting here. Just trying to do my part to get some content going

    ⚠️⚠️ TRIGGER WARNING ⚠️⚠️: This post analyses a rather infamous arc that centers on male rape.

    ⚠️⚠️ FULL SERIES SPOILERS AHEAD ⚠️⚠️

    Original Post ----------

    Mat's arc with Tylin sparks a lot of discussion, and I notice a fair number of comments wishing the books took her actions more seriously, or taking the character's amused reactions as the book itself signaling this should be funny and rightly finding that disconcerting. I want to take some time to post an analysis of this arc and show that you are meant to find her actions and the lackluster reactions of the other characters disturbing at best, and sickening at worst.

    There were a lot of great comments in this thread about how this arc was meant to mirror and comment on media from the 80's and 90's where rape of women is played for laughs. Jordan really liked to take tropes like this and reverse the roles to make a point or make people examine why they felt uneasy. I won't retread those points here, but think that thread is worth checking out.

    I had the same initial reaction, but the more I think about it, the more I like the way it's handled.

    One other thing to keep in mind with Jordan's writing is that he was absolutely steadfast in maintaining the unreliable narrator and letting things play out the way they would in real life without the book itself moralizing about right and wrong. All moralizing is done by the characters, and often we are meant to realize that what the characters are presenting as "right" is wrong. This is especially obvious in matters of fact when we know something a character is saying with 100% confidence is 100% wrong, but Jordan often does the same thing with moral lessons as well, where something a character is presenting as morally right is meant to be taken as morally wrong.

    Jordan wrote his story the way he felt it would actually unfold, and left it up to you, the reader, to apply your own moral lens without being told by the book how to feel. Character's moral sensibilities are strictly bound by their culture, upbringing, and personality. No character ever breaks the fourth wall and applies our moral sensibilities to a situation for the sake of teaching a lesson to the audience.

    That means a couple things for this arc:

    • The prose itself never casts Tylin as a rapist, since none of our protagonists see it that way. Mat is a man so they find Tylin's "pursuit" of him amusing, the way Jordan believes they actually would given their culture.

    • Mat does not have the language to describe or process what is happening to him. We clearly see he knows on some level it's wrong but his inner monologue is his normal, brash, humorous, self. Mat lies to himself about a lot of things and this is no exception.

    However, there are a couple things that I think clearly demonstrate that RJ saw her actions as wrong.

    First: Mat's inner dialog is really hard to read, he's constantly oscillating between confusion, despair, and cracking jokes. It's so clear he doesn't have the ability to process what is happening to him, and this makes his sections gut-wrenching. I think it's why so many people have a visceral reaction to the arc. A sample:

    > > > “It isn’t natural,” he burst out, yanking the pipestem from between his teeth. “I’m the one who’s supposed to do the chasing!” [Tylin's] astonished eyes surely mirrored his own. Had Tylin been a tavern maid who smiled the right way, he might have tried his luck—well, if the tavern maid lacked a son who liked poking holes in people—but he was the one who chased. He had just never thought of it that way before. He had never had the need to, before. > >

    > > > Tylin began laughing, shaking her head and wiping at her eyes with her fingers. “Oh, pigeon. I do keep forgetting. You are in Ebou Dar, now. I left a little present for you in the sitting room.” She patted his foot through the sheet. “Eat well today. You are going to need your strength.” > >

    > > > Mat put a hand over his eyes and tried very hard not to weep. When he uncovered them, she was gone. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > There was also a red silk purse holding twenty gold crowns and a note that smelled of flowers. > >

    > > > I would have bought you an earring, piglet, but I noticed your ear is not pierced. Have it done, and buy yourself something nice. > >

    > > > He nearly wept again. He gave women presents. The world was standing on its head! Piglet? Oh, Light! After a minute, he did take the mask; she owed him that much, for his coat alone. > >

    The crying is what really drives it home. If this was meant to truly be played for laughs Mat would not have such a painful inner monologue. Instead, Jordan is creating a dissonance between the humorous tone the other characters approach this arc with and Mat's inner emotional distress. It feels like Jordan asking us to consider the inner life of characters in other media that are the butt of rape jokes. Should we really be laughing at them? Or are we the palace maids to those characters' Mat?

    There's also some points to make around Mat trying to figure out why he feels this way and reaching for reasons like "I'm the one who chases" rather than "she raped me" being a really great illustration of victims who can't even articulate why something was a violation in the aftermath of a traumatic experience and the gaslighting that happens to them, but let's move on to another character who laughs at the victim.

    Second: when Mat tells Elayne what's happening, Elayne laughs at him initially, but then Mat, in a moment of selflessness, offers her the foxhead medallion to protect her from the Gohlam. She pauses, reassesses him, and:

    > > > I. . . .” That faint blush returned to her cheeks. “I am sorry I laughed at you.” She cleared her throat, looking away. “Sometimes I forget my duty to my subjects. You are a worthy subject, Matrim Cauthon. I will see that Nynaeve understands the right of . . . of you and Tylin. Perhaps we can help.” > >

    > > > “No,” he spluttered. “I mean, yes. I mean. . . . That is. . . . Oh, kiss a flaming goat if I know what I mean. I almost wish you didn’t know the truth. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > Aloud, she said, “I understand.” Sounding just as if she did. “Come along, now, Mat. We can’t waste time standing in one spot.” Gaping, he watched her lift skirts and cloak to make her way along the landing. She understood? She understood, and not one acid little comment, not one cutting remark? > >

    This moment is narrated through Mat's eyes, so we don't know exactly what Elayne is thinking, but we DO know that Elayne is often depicted as having the highest EQ / empathy in the series. She plays peacemaker between her friends, cares for animals, and is the glue that holds her, Min and Aviendha together as friends rather than rivals through the tight bonds she consciously forms with both. She makes friends easily and is fiercely protective of them.

    She also has zero issues with calling Mat on his bullshit.

    So it's telling that she seems to recognize that this is affecting Mat deeply, and respect that even if she doesn't understand it. She may not go as far as realizing what is actually happening, and it may take her a moment to get there, but we can infer from her that she recognizes on some level that Mat is in real distress over it, and reacts to that, even offering to help him resolve it. This moment really stood out to me on my first read through.

    There's a bunch of other things to dissect here, especially around the way victim-blaming and slut-shaming is interwoven into this scene (Elayne implies Mat was asking for it and got a taste of his own medicine, even though Mat is never shown flirting with someone who does not show interest), but let's move on to the next point.

    Third: Tylin is killed by the Gholam.

    Now, this may not seem like a point in the book's favor. Tylin's death seems to be played as a tragedy. When a character is killed for karmic reasons, most books wink at the reader a little, with some line of narration or dialog emphasizing that they got what was coming to them.

    This is not the case with Tylin. Robert Jordan writes Mat's reaction authentically, and Mat has come to care for his abuser, as often happens in the real world. Her death is "played" as tragedy because that's how our narrator feels about it.

    > > > Mat did not realize his knees had given way until he found himself sitting on the floor with his head buzzing. He could hear her voice. You’ll get your head cut off yet if you’re not careful, piglet, and I wouldn’t like that. Setalle leaned forward on the narrow bed to press a hand against his cheek in commiseration. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > [Tuon] was watching him, a neutral expression on her face. “Did you care for Tylin so deeply?” she said in a cautious voice. > >

    > > > “Yes. No. Burn me, I liked her!” Turning away, he scrubbed fingers through his hair, pushing the cap off. He had never been so glad to get away from a woman in his life, but this…! “And I left her tied up and gagged so she couldn’t even call for help, easy prey for the gholam,” he said bitterly. “It was looking for me. Don’t shake your head. Thom. You know it as well as I do.” > >

    But I contend that this death is one of Karmic justice. The Gholam only finds Tylin because it is looking for Mat, and his scent is all over her room as a result of her actions, so her immoral actions directly lead to her death

    Further, she is killed by the Gholam while tied up and helpless, a perfect mirror of the situations she forces on Mat with her pink ribbons. Mat even remarks that she never would have stood a chance and couldn't call for help, which has symmetry with the absolute political and social power Tylin had over him. We even have scenes earlier on when he realizes the whole palace is complicit in serving him up to Tylin and there's no one he can turn to for help.

    Such symmetry between death and actions is typical of characters being punished for their transgressions, but Jordan's style is not to moralize about it directly. Instead he presents to us the character's authentic reactions and thoughts. The symbolism and meaning is there for us to pick up on, but the unreliable narrator lenses it as a senseless killing of an innocent woman.

    Jordan wants to make us uncomfortable, but he's not interested in handing us the answer to why on a silver platter. It's up to us to use our own reasoning and morals to suss that out.

    TLDR: Jordan doesn't moralize himself in the books. He expects you to feel the outrage and uneasiness yourself, then connect the dots. Tylin's killing bears all the hallmarks of Karmic justice, so while our characters don't take what she is doing to Mat seriously, I think we are clearly meant to conclude it is wrong.

    In many ways Jordan used this arc to examine Rape Culture before "Rape Culture" was a mainstream discussion.

    3
    Books @kbin.social zalack @kbin.social
    [Cross Post: WheelofTime] Am I the only one who unironically likes all of the characters??? A list of my unpopular opinions.
    kbin.social [Spoilers All] Am I the only one who unironically likes all of the characters??? A list of my unpopular opinions. - Wheel of Time discussion - kbin.social

    Figured I would start moving over some of my high effort posts to the fediverse. This is a post I originally made on the /r/wot subreddit....

    [Spoilers All] Am I the only one who unironically likes all of the characters??? A list of my unpopular opinions. - Wheel of Time discussion - kbin.social

    Cross posting since the communities are all so small right now. Thought I would spread the content around. Please let me know if that's not okay and I will remove.

    0
    Books @kbin.social zalack @kbin.social
    Wheel of Time: We are meant to be sickened by Tylin

    I'm moving some of my higher-quality posts over from Reddit. This post was originally made on /r/wot, and as there doesn't appear to be a dedicated Wheel of Time or fantasy magazine yet, I am posting here.

    FULL SERIES SPOILERS AHEAD

    TRIGGER WARNING: This post analyses a rather infamous arc that centers on male rape.

    The original text of the post starts here:

    Mat's arc with Tylin sparks a lot of discussion, and I notice a fair number of comments wishing the books took her actions more seriously, or taking the character's amused reactions as the book itself signaling this should be funny and rightly finding that disconcerting. I want to take some time to post an analysis of this arc and show that you are meant to find her actions and the lackluster reactions of the other characters disturbing at best, and sickening at worst.

    There were a lot of great comments in this thread about how this arc was meant to mirror and comment on media from the 80's and 90's where rape of women is played for laughs. Jordan really liked to take tropes like this and reverse the roles to make a point or make people examine why they felt uneasy. I won't retread those points here, but think that thread is worth checking out.

    I had the same initial reaction, but the more I think about it, the more I like the way it's handled.

    One other thing to keep in mind with Jordan's writing is that he was absolutely steadfast in maintaining the unreliable narrator and letting things play out the way they would in real life without the book itself moralizing about right and wrong. All moralizing is done by the characters, and often we are meant to realize that what the characters are presenting as "right" is wrong. This is especially obvious in matters of fact when we know something a character is saying with 100% confidence is 100% wrong, but Jordan often does the same thing with moral lessons as well, where something a character is presenting as morally right is meant to be taken as morally wrong.

    Jordan wrote his story the way he felt it would actually unfold, and left it up to you, the reader, to apply your own moral lens without being told by the book how to feel. Character's moral sensibilities are strictly bound by their culture, upbringing, and personality. No character ever breaks the fourth wall and applies our moral sensibilities to a situation for the sake of teaching a lesson to the audience.

    That means a couple things for this arc:

    • The prose itself never casts Tylin as a rapist, since none of our protagonists see it that way. Mat is a man so they find Tylin's "pursuit" of him amusing, the way Jordan believes they actually would given their culture.

    • Mat does not have the language to describe or process what is happening to him. We clearly see he knows on some level it's wrong but his inner monologue is his normal, brash, humorous, self. Mat lies to himself about a lot of things and this is no exception.

    However, there are a couple things that I think clearly demonstrate that RJ saw her actions as wrong.

    First: Mat's inner dialog is really hard to read, he's constantly oscillating between confusion, despair, and cracking jokes. It's so clear he doesn't have the ability to process what is happening to him, and this makes his sections gut-wrenching. I think it's why so many people have a visceral reaction to the arc. A sample:

    > > > “It isn’t natural,” he burst out, yanking the pipestem from between his teeth. “I’m the one who’s supposed to do the chasing!” [Tylin's] astonished eyes surely mirrored his own. Had Tylin been a tavern maid who smiled the right way, he might have tried his luck—well, if the tavern maid lacked a son who liked poking holes in people—but he was the one who chased. He had just never thought of it that way before. He had never had the need to, before. > >

    > > > Tylin began laughing, shaking her head and wiping at her eyes with her fingers. “Oh, pigeon. I do keep forgetting. You are in Ebou Dar, now. I left a little present for you in the sitting room.” She patted his foot through the sheet. “Eat well today. You are going to need your strength.” > >

    > > > Mat put a hand over his eyes and tried very hard not to weep. When he uncovered them, she was gone. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > There was also a red silk purse holding twenty gold crowns and a note that smelled of flowers. > >

    > > > I would have bought you an earring, piglet, but I noticed your ear is not pierced. Have it done, and buy yourself something nice. > >

    > > > He nearly wept again. He gave women presents. The world was standing on its head! Piglet? Oh, Light! After a minute, he did take the mask; she owed him that much, for his coat alone. > >

    The crying is what really drives it home. If this was meant to truly be played for laughs Mat would not have such a painful inner monologue. Instead, Jordan is creating a dissonance between the humorous tone the other characters approach this arc with and Mat's inner emotional distress. It feels like Jordan asking us to consider the inner life of characters in other media that are the butt of rape jokes. Should we really be laughing at them? Or are we the palace maids to those characters' Mat?

    There's also some points to make around Mat trying to figure out why he feels this way and reaching for reasons like "I'm the one who chases" rather than "she raped me" being a really great illustration of victims who can't even articulate why something was a violation in the aftermath of a traumatic experience and the gaslighting that happens to them, but let's move on to another character who laughs at the victim.

    Second: when Mat tells Elayne what's happening, Elayne laughs at him initially, but then Mat, in a moment of selflessness, offers her the foxhead medallion to protect her from the Gohlam. She pauses, reassesses him, and:

    > > > I. . . .” That faint blush returned to her cheeks. “I am sorry I laughed at you.” She cleared her throat, looking away. “Sometimes I forget my duty to my subjects. You are a worthy subject, Matrim Cauthon. I will see that Nynaeve understands the right of . . . of you and Tylin. Perhaps we can help.” > >

    > > > “No,” he spluttered. “I mean, yes. I mean. . . . That is. . . . Oh, kiss a flaming goat if I know what I mean. I almost wish you didn’t know the truth. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > Aloud, she said, “I understand.” Sounding just as if she did. “Come along, now, Mat. We can’t waste time standing in one spot.” Gaping, he watched her lift skirts and cloak to make her way along the landing. She understood? She understood, and not one acid little comment, not one cutting remark? > >

    This moment is narrated through Mat's eyes, so we don't know exactly what Elayne is thinking, but we DO know that Elayne is often depicted as having the highest EQ / empathy in the series. She plays peacemaker between her friends, cares for animals, and is the glue that holds her, Min and Aviendha together as friends rather than rivals through the tight bonds she consciously forms with both. She makes friends easily and is fiercely protective of them.

    She also has zero issues with calling Mat on his bullshit.

    So it's telling that she seems to recognize that this is affecting Mat deeply, and respect that even if she doesn't understand it. She may not go as far as realizing what is actually happening, and it may take her a moment to get there, but we can infer from her that she recognizes on some level that Mat is in real distress over it, and reacts to that, even offering to help him resolve it. This moment really stood out to me on my first read through.

    There's a bunch of other things to dissect here, especially around the way victim-blaming and slut-shaming is interwoven into this scene (Elayne implies Mat was asking for it and got a taste of his own medicine, even though Mat is never shown flirting with someone who does not show interest), but let's move on to the next point.

    Third: Tylin is killed by the Gholam.

    Now, this may not seem like a point in the book's favor. Tylin's death seems to be played as a tragedy. When a character is killed for karmic reasons, most books wink at the reader a little, with some line of narration or dialog emphasizing that they got what was coming to them.

    This is not the case with Tylin. Robert Jordan writes Mat's reaction authentically, and Mat has come to care for his abuser, as often happens in the real world. Her death is "played" as tragedy because that's how our narrator feels about it.

    > > > Mat did not realize his knees had given way until he found himself sitting on the floor with his head buzzing. He could hear her voice. You’ll get your head cut off yet if you’re not careful, piglet, and I wouldn’t like that. Setalle leaned forward on the narrow bed to press a hand against his cheek in commiseration. > >

    > > > ... > >

    > > > [Tuon] was watching him, a neutral expression on her face. “Did you care for Tylin so deeply?” she said in a cautious voice. > >

    > > > “Yes. No. Burn me, I liked her!” Turning away, he scrubbed fingers through his hair, pushing the cap off. He had never been so glad to get away from a woman in his life, but this…! “And I left her tied up and gagged so she couldn’t even call for help, easy prey for the gholam,” he said bitterly. “It was looking for me. Don’t shake your head. Thom. You know it as well as I do.” > >

    But I contend that this death is one of Karmic justice. The Gholam only finds Tylin because it is looking for Mat, and his scent is all over her room as a result of her actions, so her immoral actions directly lead to her death

    Further, she is killed by the Gholam while tied up and helpless, a perfect mirror of the situations she forces on Mat with her pink ribbons. Mat even remarks that she never would have stood a chance and couldn't call for help, which has symmetry with the absolute political and social power Tylin had over him. We even have scenes earlier on when he realizes the whole palace is complicit in serving him up to Tylin and there's no one he can turn to for help.

    Such symmetry between death and actions is typical of characters being punished for their transgressions, but Jordan's style is not to moralize about it directly. Instead he presents to us the character's authentic reactions and thoughts. The symbolism and meaning is there for us to pick up on, but the unreliable narrator lenses it as a senseless killing of an innocent woman.

    Jordan wants to make us uncomfortable, but he's not interested in handing us the answer to why on a silver platter. It's up to us to use our own reasoning and morals to suss that out.

    TLDR: Jordan doesn't moralize himself in the books. He expects you to feel the outrage and uneasiness yourself, then connect the dots. Tylin's killing bears all the hallmarks of Karmic justice, so while our characters don't take what she is doing to Mat seriously, I think we are clearly meant to conclude it is wrong.

    In many ways Jordan used this arc to examine Rape Culture before "Rape Culture" was a mainstream discussion.

    4
    Books @kbin.social zalack @kbin.social
    Wheel of Time: Padan Fain is our biggest window into the Creator's mind

    This is a post I originally made on the /r/wot subreddit. Figured I would start moving over some of my high effort posts to the fediverse. There doesn't appear to be a big fantasy or Wheel of Time community yet so I thought I would post here

    FULL SERIES SPOILERS AHEAD

    Padan Fain gets ganked like a chump at the last battle. His incidental death disappointed many fans.

    Yet if we peek below the surface of Fain's demise, I believe hints of a subtle design in the Pattern emerge that can be spun forward into implications about the Creator's deepest convictions.

    The theory I'm about to lay out rests on an existing theory many of you will be familiar with: Fain as a backup Dark One.

    Let's review:

    In the depths of Shayul Ghul, Rand is grappling not just with the Dark One, but with himself. He enters the fray determined to destroy the Dark One for good, and throughout the battle is challenged with visions of the meaningless existence he would leave for the world, were he to achieve his goal.

    At this point, the Pattern can't rely on what Rand will choose, so it has Fain on standby to take the Dark One's place if needed. And just like the pattern shanked the False Dragons it produced after Rand took up the mantle, as soon as Rand chooses not to destroy the Dark One, the Wheel unceremoniously disposes of Fain; it's clear the burgeoning God is no longer needed to spin the Pattern as intended. Mat is just a convenient nearby tool it has arranged to complete the task.

    A few passages back this up:

    > > > [Padan Fain] was not reborn yet, not completely. He would need to find a place to infest, a place where the barriers between worlds were thin.There, he could seep his self into the very stones and embed his awareness into that location. > >

    At that moment, Fain is going towards the Mouth of Shayul Ghul to kill Rand. Rand is at the perfect place for Fain to infest: the Bore. The Pattern aimed him like an arrow towards where it needed him at the Last Battle. And it did it all the way in book one, when it tricked the Dark One into imprinting Fain on Rand.

    Let me say that again.

    The Pattern tricked the Dark One into helping create and maneuver His own replacement.

    I mean, just look at Faine's new name for himself:

    > > > Shaisam rolled onto the battlefield at Thakan’dar. > >

    Shaisam. Looks a lot like Shai'tan, huh?

    There's a few implications I LOVE about this theory. Let's look at another passage:

    > > > The process would take years, but once it happened, he would become more difficult to kill. > >

    > > > Right now, Shaisam was frail. This mortal form that walked at the center of his mind … he was bound to it. Fain, it had been. Padan Fain. > >

    > > > Still, he was vast. Those souls had given rise to much mist, and it—in turn—found others to feed upon. Men fought Shadowspawn before him. All would give him strength. > >

    This snippet implies that although Fain is vulnerable, he's approaching the amount of power he can weild. His power is, if not equal to, at least comparable to the Dark One when the Pattern composts him. This makes sense. The Pattern's need for him was imminent if the Dark One was to be destroyed; there isn't a TON of time left for him to rank up his power.

    Which leads to a conclusion: the Pattern could have also easily disposed of the Dark One at any point in the story. It just doesn't. Instead, it keeps the Dark One just contained enough to allow the universe's inhabitants to live their lives while having the choice to give into evil or not. If we think about it, walking that line likely takes even greater dominance than simply defeating the Dark One outright.

    This solves another problem. We know that in other turnings of the Wheel, the Champion of the Light went over to the Shadow. In those turnings, the war was a draw. From the Crossroads of Twilight book tour:

    > > > Robert Jordan: Yes, the Champion of the Light has gone over in the past. This is a game you have to win every time. Or rather, that you can only lose once--you can stay in if you get a draw. Think of a tournament with single elimination. If you lose once, that's it. In the past, when the Champion of the Light has gone over to the Shadow, the result has been a draw. > >

    That always struck me as weird. Can you imagine if god-tier Rand had gone over to the Shadow? How could that possibly end in anything other than a decisive loss on the Light's part? It strains credulity that the Light could eek out a draw from such a situation over and over again through eternity. Statistically, if the light has triumphed an endless number of times (because if they hadn't, the universe wouldn't exist) it' not an unlikely win, it's an inevitable one. It has to have a 100% chance of happening, because even a 0.00001% chance of the Light losing existed, it would have happened long before the turning we get to see.

    The Creator stacked the deck. The Wheel could handle Darth Rand going over to the Shadow like it easily handled Fain. As easily as it could handle the Dark One. It's not fighting against The Dark One, it needs the Dark One to fulfill its purpose and spin the Pattern, because the Pattern is dominated by the interacting lives of those grappling between choosing the Light or the Dark. It's preserving the Dark just as much as it's preserving the Light. In fact, the Pattern needs the Dark so badly the creator set up the Wheel to spin out new Dark Ones the same way it spins out Champions to fight them.

    Speaking of which, Fain's existence as the waiter-in-the-wings has a counterpart on the light. Nakomi's inclusion in the story may seem unrelated -- and often puzzling -- at first, but it plays directly into the worldbuilding here. If we accept that The Pattern has positioned her to take up the mantle of Champion should Rand fall — either to death, or despair — she and Fain as a pair reinforce that the conflict between light and dark is the greatest purpose of the Pattern, and must be kept going at all costs.

    I'm not going to belabor how CLEARLY this paints the same picture Rand ultimately embraces: to the Creator, the choice between right and wrong is essential for being human to be meaningful.

    Instead I want to examine the differences between Fain and the Dark One. The fact that they even are different is interesting. Fain is able to corrupt Trollocs and Mydrall with his power, and it changes their appearance and demeanor. From A Memory of Light:

    > > > [Faine's] drones stumbled down the hillside, cloaked in mists. Trollocs with their skin pocked, as if it had boiled. Dead white eyes. He hardly needed them any longer, as their souls had given him fuel to rebuild himself. > >

    The Dark One's followers are fueled by greed and ambition to a tee. They want to dominate others to their will, they want Immortality to rule the world.

    But Fain / Mordeth's / Shaisam's 'followers'... those he has touched like dagger-Matt, Shadar Logath, Faine's Whitecloaks -- they're disheveled where the Forsaken are polished, Paranoid where the Forsaken are conniving. Fevered where the Forsaken are cold. Isolationists where the Forsaken crave the spotlight. Give into base instinct where the Forsaken plot.

    There are theories that Elaida and Masema were touched by the Dagger, and they exhibit these same tendencies which make them feel pretty distinct from the Forsaken.

    If Fain really is meant as a possible replacement, then that means the Pattern might need that replacement. If there's even a miniscule chance Fain might be needed, then given eternity, there's an almost certain chance that the Dark One we know is not the first Dark One. And Fain is different from Shai'tan. So the Dark One before Shai'tan was likely different from Him as well.

    Why would the Wheel allow variance in the Shadow and what it brings out in people if it needs things the way they are to spin the Pattern?

    Maybe it isn't chance, maybe it's a design feature.

    The Wheel of Time offers reincarnation as a way to help people get better in each life, to build on what they learned in the past.

    Shai'tan tempts and stokes a very particular part of His followers: the hunger for power and acclaim.

    Shaisam would stoke their paranoia and distrust.

    And people would grow the most from experiencing both types of temptation and darkness. A rotating cast of Dark Ones makes the turnings of the Wheel varied enough that souls can keep growing.

    And while I'm not sure this is what Jordan intended, I think it's an interesting possibility in the text.

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    zalack zalack @kbin.social

    Formerly /u/Zalack on Reddit.

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