The So-Called “Free Speech Warriors” – Even in Switzerland, Speaking Out Can Get You Arrested
The So-Called “Free Speech Warriors” – Even in Switzerland, Speaking Out Can Get You Arrested
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Regional context
He was not allowed to enter switzerland because Fedpol feared that he calls for violence and actively promotes Hamas (which Switzerland considers a terror organisation). As he crossed the border anyway, he got arrested and deported.
You can’t enter a country without a visa and wonder why you get arrested…
If that's the conclusion you've arrived at after reading nazi-friendly content, then you're probably a nazi too.
Ali Abunimah was born and raised in the U.S., so we can safely assume he possesses the U.S. citizenship and passport. What does Switzerland's official immigration website have to say about U.S. citizens? Oh yeah, that's right, you get full-on red carpet drawn for you:
And if the state designates an organization as a terrorist group, then that's that right? We can just throw away our critical thinking (assuming we had any in the first place) and let the state known for rubbing elbows with nazis do the thinking for us, right? Piss off with that racist bullshit.
Note that while entering the Schengen area does not require a visa for USA citizens, you do have to get a visa waiver which is subject to limitations. See this document.
That's true, starting from this year. I couldn't find more information about this through primary sources of how tedious it is compared to your average long-and-arduous visa procedures that Global South countries are subjected to, but it appears to be a relatively quick non-process: https://www.axa-schengen.com/en/visa/visit-schengen/usa#1
The reason for his deportation wasn't because "he didn't have a visa" like the original comment purported as one of the points, or a lack of a visa-waiver for that matter. It was clear-cut "he's too brown for our liking" but with glitter all over.
Note that Switzerland is not in Schengen
Switzerland is in Schengen, but didn't join until 2004.
Apparently since 2024, according to this
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/switzerland/visa/
Missed that…
So i messed up that “Einreiseverbot” and “visa” is not the same. I think any non Swiss person can be refused to enter the country, if you are popular enough that fedpol fears about safety of the people in Switzerland.
Congrats on confirming that you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
Thank you!
Apparently since 2024, according to this
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/switzerland/visa/
Missed that…
So i messed up that “Einreiseverbot” and “visa” is not the same. I think any non Swiss person can be refused to enter the country, if you are popular enough that fedpol fears about safety of the people in Switzerland.
Switzerland is in Schengen area and in EFTA but not in EU.
Apparently since 2024, according to this
https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/switzerland/visa/
Missed that…
So i messed up that “Einreiseverbot” and “visa” is not the same. I think any non Swiss person can be refused to enter the country, if you are popular enough that fedpol fears about safety of the people in Switzerland.
Edit: shengen was joined at 2008!
Stop spreading misinformation, Switzerland is fully in Schengen since 2008.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/ALL/?uri=CELEX%3A32008D0903
Thank you for correcting! 🙏🏻
I got confused somehow, was not intentional
The words "islamist" or "islamism" are so utterly meaningless nowadays. Basically means "brown person whose opinion we don't like".
I mean, there are things to critizise about him. But anyone who calls him an islamist juts shows his bigotry or utter stupidity.
(US citizens also don't need a visa to enter Switzerland, but that is a technicality.)
I have not enough knowledge about him to say if it was reasonable to not let him in, but his post on X seemed to celebrate destruction and murder.
I think it is in the manner of “better safe than sorry” it is reasonable to not give this man a visa. And I very much hope that a person celebrating Israel’s attacks would neither.
Right to defend is not equal celebrating death and destruction like it was some sort of a fucking party…
I agree with you, that Israel did not handle the situation like they should have. But I agree with Fedpol as well, to not let any extremist disturb the cultural peace we currently have in Switzerland.
And how does this make him an islamist?
You've just involuntarily proven my point that the word "islamist" is just utterly arbitrary and mostly just used to hide racism at this point.
Umm, in the article I posted is nowhere written islamist. Only extremist supporting for palestine (and hamas as it seems).
Fedpol will ban any too popular person it thinks has connections to hamas from entering Switzerland
Then why does you answer to my comment have nothing to do with the point of my comment.
Maybe it have to spell it out: My point was that western media use the word "islamist" utterly arbitrary to attack brown people of any ideology, thus rendering the term useless. And that is discustingly racist. This is especially true for far right media like the NZZ that you cited.
Your point was that you apparently presume that I defend him, which I didn't. He blocked me ten years ago in Twitter after a heated discussion. I don't like him.
I now presume that your are discussing with bad intentions.
You ask me how it makes him an islamist after I commented regional context, i answer that I and the article never stated that he is a “islamist” (what that even mean, isn’t that just the same as saying someone is Jude/Christian??), and then you said I missed the point
🙉WTF
Lol, I have to check out if I can block you. I despice right wing trolls. But this is the headline of the article you cited and on which I commented:
"Erneut hätte ein Islamist in Zürich auftreten sollen, nun ist der Mann verhaftet worden. Regierungsrat Mario Fehr spricht von einem «Judenhasser»"
Und "Islamist" heißt auf english halt "islamist". Versuch nicht meinen Kommentar zu verdrehen. Unglaublich, AFD-Taktiken...
My whole comment was about the use of the word islamist and you act like I defended him. I call this "ill faith".
Of course you can block me, but what is it worth? It limits you to see other opinions..
😆damn, and yea you are right, i have overseen that.
How to you call people who believe in the islamistic religion, if islamist is wrong?
Fedpol will ban people connected to political causes and organizations it deems unacceptable.
Yes, that's the point. That's the thing we're calling out.
But isn’t it understandable that Switzerland does not want foreign political organisations to interfere with the political landscape in Switzerland?
As told above already, I just hope (and fear that is not) that similar extremists supporting attacks from Isreal, are banned from entering our country as well.
But isn’t it understandable that Switzerland does not want foreign political organisations to interfere with the political landscape in Switzerland?
Is Switzerland banning everyone who's expressed support for a foreign political organization? No? Ok then, guess that's not what this is about.
As told above already, I just hope (and fear that is not) that similar extremists supporting attacks from Isreal, are banned from entering our country as well.
They aren't and won't be though. You know that, and you know why. They also won't be banning people supporting attacks by the USA, or Ukraine, or any NATO power. Because that's not what it's about.
Supporter and Extremist is not the same.
I don’t know this person not well enough to decide where to place him, but seeing his post on X, I strongly assume, that he advocated violence.
Supporter and Extremist is not the same.
Given that merely supporting Hamas apparently makes you an extremist, they sure seem to be.
I strongly assume, that he advocated violence
So anyone who supports the military is an extremist?
Yea, Supporting Hamas does, if you actually try convincing other people to do the same, since Switzerland officially sees Hamas as Terror organisation. Fedpol has only acted based on that, but not decided it.
Just supporting Palestine does not make you extremist
Yea, anyone who supports military to invade other countries is in my eyes an extremist. But I have to investigate how the definition of extremist is officially in swiss government.
but his post on X seemed to celebrate destruction and murder.
Lol, if Switzerland kicked out every European who generically celebrated destruction or murder, it would be an empty country.
Only popular people get onto the radar of Fedpol.
And Switzerland has swiss citizens, there are not only European people in Switzerland.
And yea, I agree, that Fedpol does not always do the right decision, meaning false positives and false negatives.
But with this guy, I agree with fedpol, at least with that little information I have, hope this X posts are really from him and mot a smear campaign.
Really? So no popular supporter of Israels genocide has ever been to Switzerland? No supporter of the Iraq War? No popular person who has celebrated murder or destruction by a western power has ever been to Switzerland?
I'm going to let you in on a secret: Switzerland? It's actually in Europe.
And by "doesn't always make the right decision" you mean it makes its decision based on whether or not it agrees with the particular instance of murder and destruction being celebrated.
Yes, I gathered you agree with banning free speech you disagree with.
I need more evidence than a single entity that was bot let in and is in my opinion ok to not let in to conclude that we have a systemic problem in fedPol
I hope there are some good quality investigation reports about that
Supporter and extremist is not the same
My personal opinion is, that every country has “bad” and “good” people and I have no desire to have extremists in my country
If fedPol really does such a bad job preventing Israel supporting extremism from entering Switzerland, we indeed have to change that.
I support free speech and I am thankful for al the crical thinking in this comment thread. We don’t solve problems by ignoring each other.
Supporter and extremist is not the same
Yes, actually, it is.
My personal opinion is, that every country has “bad” and “good” people and I have no desire to have extremists in my country
Great, when are you going to be leaving?
If fedPol really does such a bad job preventing Israel supporting extremism from entering Switzerland, we indeed have to change that.
You're not going to though. You will continue to persecute opposition to it though.
I support free speech
No. You don't. You support speech that is not too far from what you believe, but nothing too different.
With that definition, I would be an extremist as well, lol
Not gonna leave a country where we have a working mechanism to make changes in the constitution based on the will of it’s people
If that is the case, I will donate to organisations who make a proper investigation about it and use its results to issue an initiative changing that. I do that via the party that I am a member of (swiss pirate party)
😆how do you get to that conclusion, I am all in for free speech, as long as it don’t celebrate violence
With that definition, I would be an extremist as well, lol
Yes, correct. Sounds like you're finally starting to understand my point.
Not gonna leave a country where we have a working mechanism to make changes in the constitution based on the will of it’s people
Oh sorry, I thought you said you don't want extremists in your country.
I am all in for free speech, as long as it don’t celebrate violence
So you are, in fact, not for free speech. Given you apparently don't think people should be allowed to openly celebrate things like the defeat of the Nazis
Though I notice you yourself support the violent act of expelling a person from a part of our shared planet.
*extremist because I do support Palestine, and have the opinion that the Israel government has fucked up hard / is to be considered a terror organisation as well.
I do not see myself as extremist
I support celebrating defence but I do not support invasion
And attack a neighbour directly with 1000x power as answer of an event is not only defending
To nuance my sentence above
I am ok with “i think we need violence to achieve this” etc as opinion
But “these dogs need all to be hanged and killed like they were no humans” is not ok.