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Of course I do see the facist tendencies also in Israel and their government. And of course, I never said what happened to palestine now and before is all fun and games. It's just that I think Hamas and leaving them unchecked is so much worse. That's it really, choosing the lesser of two evils.
"Lesser of two evils"
Being a victim of systemic genocide because you have cousins who fought against being genocides is "more evil" than actually systematically genociding people?
See it's things like these which make my stomach turn over when I read your comments.
So do you deny Israel is genociding Palestinians?
In one of you comments, you said that under no circumstances should anyone be killing kids.
Israel is knowingly and willingly killing women and children, in horrific amounts.
https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm
##Two Thirds of Gaza War Dead Are Women and Children, Briefers Say, as Security Council Debates Their Plight
Sima Sami Bahous, Executive Director of the United Nations Entity for Gender Equality and the Empowerment of Women (UN-Women), recalled that women and girls pay the highest price when armed conflict erupts. Since 7 October, when Hamas fighters attacked Israel, 67 per cent of the more than 14,000 people killed in Gaza are estimated to be women and children. “That is two mothers killed every hour and seven women every two hours,” she said. “We mourn them all.”
Every day, 180 women are giving birth without water, painkillers, anaesthesia for Caesarean sections, electricity for incubators or medical supplies, she said. Mothers, meanwhile, mix baby formula with contaminated water — when they find it — and go without food so that their children can live another day. “Women in Gaza have told us that they pray for peace, but that if peace does not come, they pray for a quick death, in their sleep, with their children in their arms,” she said. “It should shame us all that any mother, anywhere, has such a prayer.”
Could you imagine defending Hitler in 1940 by saying "I'm choosing the lesser evil"? Probably not. So open your eyes and smell the genocide.
In my book it's more like Hamas=Hitler and bombing Gaza=bombing Dresden if we want to keep the analogies.
And also your twisting my words, I was talking about targeting kids. The question is are the kids dying because they are actively being targeted or because Hamas dug a tunnel under their house. That's a difference. And actively targeting kids is 100% not IDF military doctrine, the same is evidently not true for Hamas.
Have you spent a year in birthright or why is a German so utterly, utterly delusional and brainwashed? Oh no wait, you never said you were German. You only said you grew up there. Going by your rhetoric, you've definitely listened to Israeli state propaganda, and a lot of it.
I did very early on say I'm amazed at the level of your delusions.
Israel is targeting kids. They know this. Everyone know this. There's A METRIC FUCKTON OF OBJECTIVE EVIDENCE OF IT WHICH YOU KEEP IGNORING.
Carpet bombing an area in which more than 50% of the population are kids is targeting kids.
You're simply so brainwashed you will never accept this. You're like the Germans who allowed Jewish people to be genocided in plain view, yelling Heil Hitler, but after the war pretended they knew nothing about it.
You think Israeli state propaganda is more accurate than the rest of the world? The reports of the UN and all news sources, all fake, owned by Hamas? Because Israel is the only one denying what everyone can see. A despicable, horrible, purposeful genocide in which a vast majority of victims are women and children.
You are contributing to murdering women and children with that rhetoric, you sick f*ck.
#West Bank: Spike in Israeli Killings of Palestinian Children
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/28/west-bank-spike-israeli-killings-palestinian-children
#2022 becomes the deadliest year for Palestinian children in the West Bank in over 15 years
On 19 December 2023, between 2000 and 2300 hours, IDF reportedly surrounded and raided Al Awda building, also known as the “Annan building”, in Al Remal neighborhood, Gaza City, where three related families were sheltering in addition to Annan family. According to witness accounts circulated by media sources and Euro-Med Human Rights Monitor, while in control of the building and the civilians sheltering there, the IDF allegedly separated the men from the women and children, and then shot and killed at least 11 of the men, mostly aged in their late 20’s and early 30’s, in front of their family members. The IDF then allegedly ordered the women and children into a room, and either shot at them or threw a grenade into the room, reportedly seriously injuring some of them, including an infant and a child. OHCHR has confirmed the killings at Al Awdabuilding, although the details and circumstances of the killings are still under verification. IDF has not released any information on the incident.
https://press.un.org/en/2023/gashc4386.doc.htm
#Third Committee Condemns Brutal Bombing of Gaza Hospital, Enforced Displacement of Palestinian Civilians, Emphasizes Urgent Need for Unimpeded Humanitarian Aid
AND the systemic targeting has been going on for years.
https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-179791/
Since 1967, Israel has systematically targeted Palestinians including children – HRC 28th session – NGO Submission, Annex (Palestine Independent Commission for Human Rights)
How fucking childish does a person need to be to believe Israeli state porpaganda? You probably also think Putler didn't have Navalny killed? That a healthy man in his forties just happened to drop dead?
Do you understand the size difference between Gaza and Afghanistan? Keep that in mind.
As the IDF dropped more bombs on Gaza in 6 days than the US did on Afghanistan in a year.
#Daily death rate in Gaza higher than any other major 21st Century conflict - Oxfam
#Palestinian death toll passes 25,000 as Israel announces the death of another hostage
**More than half of those are children. **
"iSrAeL iSnT tArGeTiNg kIdS!!!" — brainwashed morons
If you don't accept that Israel is committing crimes against humanity, that they're committing genocide, then you are literally delusional.
Wtf you're making this about my family background now? Which by the way is german for as far as I can trace it back, and that's quite a few generations. But how is this relevant?
And you're mixing stuff up, like Afghanistan also has quite a different population density and consists of desert for a large part, that might have something to do with it don't you think? And the nature of the conflict is also quite different.
And you know what? I'm not even denying that atrocities like Annan building happen also on IDF side. But these are nutjubs that act without IDF chain of command approval and without following standard IDF processes. And there is a legal system in place where they are being dealt with and punished. Is it still unfair? Of course it is. But in palestine terrorist attackers are hailed as martyrs and their families get payouts by Hamas. That still makes the Israeli side much better in my view.
And also it's not Israel vs. the rest of the world as you make it out to be. Israel is far from isolated on this and for a good reason.
"about my family background"
Why would this be related to your family? Unless I'm right in that you've been to birthright in Israel, but your family is irrelevant, even if connected. So that's a yes. Wasn't really hard to imagine, truly. Because I was being serious, anyone supporting Israel like you are, denying their atrocities and the fact that they are genociding women and children is literally under the influence of the zionist propaganda. It's not your fault, they're really good at it. You're a victim of propaganda.
Still, it doesn't change the fact, does it now?
https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/01/1145937
Detailing the provisional measures that Israel should implement, the ICJ judge noted that both South Africa and Israel were States parties to Genocide Convention and therefore had agreed “to prevent and to punish the crime of genocide”.
Quoting article 2 of the key international treaty signed in the aftermath of the Second World War, Judge Donoghue explained that genocide was defined as “acts committed with an intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group”.
The two-million-strong Palestinian population did indeed constitute a distinct group in the court’s view, she said.
Turning to the article 3 of the Genocide Convention, which prohibits “conspiracy to commit genocide” and public incitement to commit genocide, the judge said that the ICJ had taken note of a number of statements made by senior Israeli officials.
These included comments by Yoav Galant, Defense Minister of Israel, who reportedly told troops on the border with the enclave that they were fighting “human animals” who were the “ISIS of Gaza”.
Israel is committing genocide. Killing women and children.
https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aje/2024/israel-war-on-gaza-10000-children-killed/
But you're making sick excuses and justifications for the genocide, and saying "the Israeli side is better" as if the Palestinian women and children were doing anything to Israel. You don't even have the ability to discern between Hamas, a terrorist organisation, and the people of Palestine. Because you've been brainwashed into thinking they're all the same and thus it's justified to exterminate them all.
It's sickening to me that despite the horrors inflicted on the Jewish people in WWII, they're still doing this now. It's sickening.
I don't know, you're down to personal insults now and framing me as a bad human? So I'm falling for pro Israel propaganda? Have you considered that maybe it is you who is falling for Hamas propaganda?
"Mommy, please, that man on the internet called me a bad name for actively supporting the genocide of women and children. He's the baddie, but we aren't, right?"
Oh no, words, they're so terribly hurtful.
I use United Nations and the consensus of the international community to make my decisions. You use shitty lies perpetuated by zionists. You haven't posted a single source for any of your claims, and purposefully ignored the ones I've sent, because you're literally made to think they're not real by conditioning you into not accepting that Israel ever does anything bad.
Your refusal to believe Israel is GENOCIDING WOMEN AND CHILDREN is what shows how brainwashed you are.
https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aje/2024/israel-war-on-gaza-10000-children-killed/
#West Bank: Spike in Israeli Killings of Palestinian Children
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/28/west-bank-spike-israeli-killings-palestinian-children
##2022 becomes the deadliest year for Palestinian children in the West Bank in over 15 years
##Israel is knowingly and willingly killing women and children, in horrific amounts.
https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm
##Two Thirds of Gaza War Dead Are Women and Children, Briefers Say, as Security Council Debates Their Plight
Sima Sami Bahous, Executive Director of the United Nations Entity for Gender Equality and the Empowerment of Women (UN-Women), recalled that women and girls pay the highest price when armed conflict erupts. Since 7 October, when Hamas fighters attacked Israel, 67 per cent of the more than 14,000 people killed in Gaza are estimated to be women and children. “That is two mothers killed every hour and seven women every two hours,” she said. “We mourn them all.”
Every day, 180 women are giving birth without water, painkillers, anaesthesia for Caesarean sections, electricity for incubators or medical supplies, she said. Mothers, meanwhile, mix baby formula with contaminated water — when they find it — and go without food so that their children can live another day. “Women in Gaza have told us that they pray for peace, but that if peace does not come, they pray for a quick death, in their sleep, with their children in their arms,” she said. “It should shame us all that any mother, anywhere, has such a prayer.”
Could you imagine defending Hitler in 1940 by saying “I’m choosing the lesser evil”? Probably not. So open your eyes and smell the genocide.
You couldn't hurt me if you tried, it's just that this is not a basis for discussion.
And maybe look at the sources yourself, does it say Israel and IDF are the sole cause and the only side to blame for this? That part is just your interpretation.
And actually I'm curious, what do you think how Israel should react to the attacks? Roll over and take it to the chin? Just surrender and let the killings and rocket attacks happen? Because apparently Hamas outsmarted them and human shield tactics are supposed to work? Better directly surrender then, since confronting Hamas is equal to genocide? Is that it?
Still vehemently denying that Israel is committing genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity.
You're just unable to accept it. Literally. You will not be able to address a single article of the UN and OCHR I've linked and accept them as reality. Do you not understand how childish it is to pretend that second hand Israeli propaganda is more credible than the rest of the world combined?
Prove me wrong and address these WOMEN AND CHILDREN BEING PURPOSEFULLY KILLED BY ISRAEL.
It makes my stomach hurt knowing that people like you exist, that people will defend a genocide, of slaughtering children, while pretending they care about children dying.
It's insane.
"How do you think Israel should react"
How about by not committing genocide? That's a good start, in my opinion. How about not using collective punishment, which is a LITERAL WAR CRIME?
So you think Israel shouldn't be held to the standards of international laws, and should be allowed to act like an international terrorist organisation, and should be allowed to continue a literal GENOCIDE?
Imagine if you had lived 90 years earlier and you'd have to listen to non-Jewish Germans going on about "well Germany shouldn't just sit and take these [a horrible ethnic insult] taking over our jobs and industries. They're all to blame for! Let's get them in the gas chambers! It's ONLY REASONABLE!"
You sicken me. Prove me wrong and address even one of these articles.
https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aje/2024/israel-war-on-gaza-10000-children-killed/
#West Bank: Spike in Israeli Killings of Palestinian Children
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/28/west-bank-spike-israeli-killings-palestinian-children
##2022 becomes the deadliest year for Palestinian children in the West Bank in over 15 years
##Israel is knowingly and willingly killing women and children, in horrific amounts.
https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm
##Two Thirds of Gaza War Dead Are Women and Children, Briefers Say, as Security Council Debates Their Plight
Sima Sami Bahous, Executive Director of the United Nations Entity for Gender Equality and the Empowerment of Women (UN-Women), recalled that women and girls pay the highest price when armed conflict erupts. Since 7 October, when Hamas fighters attacked Israel, 67 per cent of the more than 14,000 people killed in Gaza are estimated to be women and children. “That is two mothers killed every hour and seven women every two hours,” she said. “We mourn them all.”
Every day, 180 women are giving birth without water, painkillers, anaesthesia for Caesarean sections, electricity for incubators or medical supplies, she said. Mothers, meanwhile, mix baby formula with contaminated water — when they find it — and go without food so that their children can live another day. “Women in Gaza have told us that they pray for peace, but that if peace does not come, they pray for a quick death, in their sleep, with their children in their arms,” she said. “It should shame us all that any mother, anywhere, has such a prayer.”
https://www.ohchr.org/en/stories/2024/01/gaza-massive-human-rights-crisis-and-humanitarian-disaster
#Over one hundred days into the war, Israel destroying Gaza’s food system and weaponizing food, say UN human rights experts
"WEAPONISING FOOD"
And you're still defending them. Disgustingly inhumane.
I mean for real, you're accusing me of falling for Israel propaganda but don't you see how you are using propaganda rhetoric yourself? Like always twisting my words and not only mine, you're misrepresenting your sources.
Like Mrs Bahous "women and children pay the highest price" of course that's spot on and nothing about it is controversial. But given that, how do you jump to the conclusion that Israel is genociding the people of palestine? Or that Israel is actively targeting women and children? These are entirely different things.
And always throwing this accusation of genocide around as if it is the killer argument to end all discussion. And it's not true I'm sorry. Did Israel not publicly announce their military campaign weeks in advance and tell people to evacuate from the northern regions and the conflict zones? Don't they have this roof knocking thing going on? Are these not facts? Are these not measures to minimize the civilian deaths? Is this what genocide looks like to you? How on earth does this make sense if Israel is on a mission to kill all civilians and eradicate the people of palestine? Don't you see the contradiction? It's so stupid, when at the same time you could have argued that maybe Israels reaction is out of proportion or maybe their cost-benefit analysis is off. That would have given your arguments so much more credibility and could have been a meaningful basis for discussion. But no, it always has to be all or nothing, Israel is the evil zionist empire conspiring to control the world and genociding peaceful civilians out of pure and baseless hate.
And you're evading my arguments and also my questions if they become to hard? If civilian deaths=automatic genocide and if Hamas is hiding among civilians, then what should Israels reaction have been? And please don't give me any bullshit answers. I'm not asking what they should have done in the past and I'm not asking what they should not have done. I'm asking what do you think would be the appropriate reaction to this recent episode of the conflict.