Updated - programming.dev defederation on hold
Updated - programming.dev defederation on hold
Update: In light of the programming.dev update here https://programming.dev/post/8399272, the defederation is no longer going ahead.
However, something more needs to be said. Even here on Blahaj, some of our users took issue with the choice to defederate over this issue.
So I would like to give some background and context.
Blahaj Zone exists, because both Kaity and I left mainstream social media to escape transphobia. Reddit, with its lackluster approach to fighting transphobia, and twitter, with its outright celebration of transphobia pushed us here, to the fediverse, and to create Blahaj Zone and Blahaj Lemmy.
To that end, we will continue to treat transphobia seriously. Our goal is to create a space where gender diverse folk can exist and let our defenses down a little, where we don't have to worry about getting dragged in to an argument with a transphobe, or a bad faith actor "just asking questions".
If you are looking for a more reddit like experience, where in the interest of increased engagement, we let low level transphobia slide, and push responsibility for dealing with it on to community mods and individual users, then you will likely not be happy with blahaj going forward. If you choose to stay here, understand that we may defederate again in the future over similar issues.
The choice is yours.
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It has recently been brought to my attention that the lead admin of programming.dev is engaging in ongoing transphobia.
You can see the conversation in question here https://programming.dev/comment/6131539
For that reason we will be defederating from programming.dev in 48 hours.
There are only three communities on that instance used by small number of our users, so this won't have a big impact, but if you are one of those users, you will need to use an alt account on another instance if you wish to access the communities.
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A shame. It reads (particularly at the top of that thread) like an ignorant Admin and a typical Hexbear user(s).
Please note when I say that that I am not suggesting or implying that the Admin was not in the wrong, but that when the Admin said:
It’s literally the opposite of transphobic. It’s like they tried as hard as they could to negate everything bad JKR has ever said…
That seems more like something someone ignorant of a lot of things would say and not necessarily what someone intent on being awful would say. The response to them, also from a Hexbear user, was:
You’re a transphobic clown that cares more about your Harry Potter treats than trans people. Stop pretending otherwise.
Maybe that's true and maybe it's not. Certainly in the remainder of that thread, the Admin falls pretty short of decent behaviour. However, I think if that first response to the Admin's response had not been so judgemental and had maybe seen it as ignorance rather than malice and level headedly gone on to explain why the Admin is wrong without the (i think we can all agree) standard Hexbear method of engagement, maybe (not definitely, but maybe) the outcome might have been an ally rather than a defederation.
I suspect that I'm going to get responses to that paragraph stating it's not a trans persons responsibility to educate others. I do see that and understand it as I am part of a minority group that has been marginalised, persecuted and wished out of existence for hundreds if not thousands of years. I understand exactly how annoying and exhausting it is to feel like you have to continually explain why it's OK you exist.
But I've also come to realise the difference between ignorance and wilful ignorance and that it's always worth making at least one try with someone. 99% of the time it gets you nowhere, but sometimes it gets you an ally.
I understand the defederation decision and it doesn't affect my choice to be on Blahaj at all. I guess my hope is that the two Admin's can talk it out and that refederation is an available option but that if that doesn't happen, the PD Admin at least learns how they behaved is transphobic and they change their ways.
We're talking about it now, but due to timezones and travel, I can't say where the talks will lead.
I will also say though, that as as admin that has been actively targeted by a Hexbear pileon, it's not an excuse to erase trans folks pronouns as a side issue, or to call people insane for trying to explain why the Potter IP is harmful to trans folk.
I absolutely agree with both points.
I just can't help feeling that had that initial exchange been with a non-Hexbear user(s), it might've developed differently. I don't know that for a fact obviously and maybe the PD Admin has a history of that sort of behaviour, I'm solely going by what was in that thread. By no means am I excusing their later behaviour, which was transphobic, all I'm saying is that those two sentences that I quoted seem (to me anyway) to be the flashpoint and that if it had not been a Hexbear pile on, ignorance could've been challenged in a way that might've lead to allyship.
Right, but this isn't an educational instance. We're not here to take hits with a smile whilst folk learn. This space exists to give gender diverse folk a space where they can let their guard down. The needs of gender diverse folk are the priority for me.
And look, I get the frustration with Hexbear. I've been targeted by their pile-ons, and I'm still a regular punching bag for them. But if that ever leads me to minimise the oppression of people who experience bigotry that I don't have to deal with, I absolutely deserve to be called out for it. Openly and loudly, because I'm an instance admin. My voice is seen as representing my community, and the same is true of all admins.
Right, but this isn’t an educational instance. We’re not here to take hits with a smile whilst folk learn. This space exists to give gender diverse folk a space where they can let their guard down. The needs of gender diverse folk are the priority for me.
This is the biggest reason I still use blahaj sans 196.
We should not have to play teacher every time someone tries to attack trans people.
I guess I don't see the attack? The discussion got heated, but they didn't attack trans people, they used they/them to refer someone whose pronouns they didn't know and then got defensive when they got accused of intentional misgendering. They reacted poorly and worded it badly, so it should be a learning experience for them, but it doesn't mean they're a transphobe.
And the whole Hogwarts Legacy thing is a difference of opinion, not an attack on trans people either. They weren't even defending JKR.
I agree that we don't need to play teacher when someone tries to attack us, but we also don't need to attack anyone who says anything slightly misinformed. There's a middle ground there.
"tries to attack trans people" was a general use of the phrase.
I don't think the PD admin was intentionally attacking trans people, though I do feel that his behavior was furthering transphobic discourse. Especially because he doubled down when told he was misgendering someone. Calling trans people "overly sensitive" and "easily offended" blurs the line between an attack towards trans people and general ignorance about trans people for sure, but the point is Ada doesn't want either case to be allowed here.
I see then.
I guess I'm just realizing maybe this safe space is too safe for me. I want someplace that takes transphobia seriously, but I also want to be able to have enough people outside my trans bubble to talk to. I suppose I just draw the line somewhere different.
I get that, I really do. As I said previously, belonging to a minority group myself I don't see it as my responsibility to teach everyone who's uninformed. I'm definitely not saying anyone should accept any kind of comment with a smile, but there are times when I do do that both on and offline if I feel the comment in question was genuine ignorance rather than malice. I realise that that is my choice and doesn't reflect on how anyone else handles situations like this and that as Admin of Blahaj you have a duty of care to all its users.
I guess I feel that allies (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically trans allies or disability allies or queer allies etc) are increasingly rare and if there's an opportunity to alleviate someone's genuine ignorance, its a chance worth taking. But I also realise there's a possibility I'm being naive.
When you see enough of it you can generally tell within the first couple interactions whether or not someone is being willfully ignorant vs genuinely ignorant. People who are being genuinely ignorant tend not to dig their feet in and double down when told something is offensive or harmful towards a marginalized group.
You're certainly free to try and educate people, but trying to educate someone who has already made up their mind is a Sisyphean task.
Yep, all true.
My own reaction to the Admin's first comment was 'ignorance' which then devolved as the thread devolved.
Although from own experience, even genuinely ignorant people do a fair bit of digging in at first too. Challenging someone's opinion is difficult. But you're right, there does come a point when you realise you're flogging a dead horse.
You'll get responses alright. Flurpity herpity floor.