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This is somewhat closer to some historical ideas on sex and gender than our strict homo/hetero divide.
In the classical period manliness in sex was more about being the penetrator rather than who you were penetrating. Intercrucial sex as he describes was quite popular among the Greeks, I believe. "You're only gay if you take it" is an attitude that still exists in some places.
The insecure need to deny the "gayness" is quite childish and perpetuates damaging homophobia, but you can identify as a man, fuck men, and not identify as gay. Human sexual is broader than the boundaries any one culture tries to put on it.
The insecure need to deny the "gayness" is quite childish and perpetuates damaging homophobia,
you can identify as a man, fuck men, and not identify as gay.
Hopefully you are talking about a broader spectrum because this feels contradictory. Bordering the spectrum is not helpful. We striving for people to be more open. There isn't anything to be ashamed of suggesting you are gay, even if you only like a very specific subset. In most cases the avoidance to the word is not because it's too exclusive but because they are afraid of the label.
You shouldn't be ashamed, or shamed for your private life if it doesn't hurt people
If I've misunderstood your point, let me know.
There isn’t anything to be ashamed of suggesting you are gay
No, for sure, definitely not. That shame - and the juvenile belief that being identified by others as gay is somehow damaging - is harmful. The insecure need to claim 'no homo' perpetuates homophobia. I wanted to state that clearly so my next point isn't misunderstood.
'Gay' is an identity that some people feel applies to them and others do not. Often when you hear, for example, public health officials talking about the '22-23 mpox outbreak, they used terms like 'men who have sex with men' - because men who identify as straight or primarily straight still occasionally have sex with men.
Similarly, plenty of people who identify as gay have sex or have had sex with the opposite gender. Among my gay friends gold star gays are a minority, but I'm 40 and suspect the numbers look different among younger folks. But that doesn't make them shamefully closeted bisexuals, as real as bi-erasure is.
These labels are not iron-clad descriptions of immutable fact, they're identities with fuzzy edges that only roughly describe how we see ourselves and how we want the world to see us.
It is possible to maintain a healthy, homophobia-free identity as a straight man, while still having sex with other men. It's definitely far less common in most parts of the US than a homophobia-laden gay man like Lindsey Graham. But identity is identity whereas behavior is behavior and the two aren't always linked in ways that fit our culture's expectations.
That's not true. Homosexuality has always considered bad and sexual relations with another man were considered gay.
A few years ago buzzfeed decided to give their perspectives on history and invented this false narrative that people in the past were more tolerant of gays.
You could just do some basic fact checking yourself. There is an entire wiki entry on Homosexuality in ancient Rome. And Greece. And China
The conquest mentality and "cult of virility" shaped same-sex relations. Roman men were free to enjoy sex with other males without a perceived loss of masculinity or social status, as long as they took the dominant or penetrative role.
The ancient Greeks did not conceive of sexual orientation as a social identity as modern Western societies have done. Greek society did not distinguish sexual desire or behavior by the gender of the participants, but rather by the role that each participant played in the sex act, that of active penetrator or passive penetrated.
Opposition to homosexuality in China rose in the medieval Tang dynasty, but did not become fully established until the late Qing dynasty and the Chinese Republic.
I did dig into this and it turns out I was on the right track. A few Modern "historians" have been trying to revise history with some skechy interpretations of ancient literature thinking it meat that figures were gay or approving of gay relationships. While ignoring all the other literature and context.
If you dig into each of the examples in your link you'll find no evidence.
Ancient Greeks and Roman's hated gays and all throughout their literature they use gay as an insult. That thing about only the bottom being gay is also horseshit. If you lay at all with a man they considered you a homosexual.
What's your opinion on the Sacred Band of Thebes?
Sorry, app glitched and replied to wrong comment.
Thebes was a strong end to the sacred band saga. I thought it did a good job tying up the story ends. It turns out the real sacred band was the band of friends we made along the way.
i mean have you looked in classical history at all?
You sure are giving a lot of power to Buzzfeed, unless this is sarcasm.
Surely this is sarcasm, right?
Metatron fan who watched the LGBTQ+ video recently?
You should read the Reddit badhistory post about that video - it debunks a lot of what he said and points out all his omissions.
Holy shit. If you're a troll, top marks. I legit laughed out loud.