Families upended by school shootings share trauma in push for gun law changes, but get mixed results
Families upended by school shootings share trauma in push for gun law changes, but get mixed results
Throughout the corridors of many state Capitols, families are sharing emotionally gutting stories of tragedy caused by mass school shootings with the hope that revealing their trauma will convince lawmakers on either side of the political aisle to reconsider firearm policies.
inb4 gunheads seeth over their right to carry murder tools is better than a childs right to not be shot
As long as the 2nd amendment is in place it's not possible to ban guns. It will not happen.
Now, that being said, if you don't like that, there is a process to fix it:
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Get two thirds of the House to agree on a new amendment. 290 votes out of 435. The problem with that is the House is currently struggling to get a 218 vote simple majority on basic things, like "Who is the House leader?" or "Can we fund the government?"
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Once you get that, then you need 67 votes in the Senate, the same body incapacitated by a 60 vote majority to overcome the filibuster placed on, well, everything. The Republicans in the Senate block everything.
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Assuming you get enough people for 1 and 2, now it goes to the states for ratification. You need 38 out of 50. To put that in perspective, in 2020 Joe Biden won 25 states + Washington DC. Donald Trump won 25 states. To pass a new gun amendment, you would need ALL 25 Biden states + 13 Trump states. Any Biden state that refuses to ratify means you need an extra Trump state. There are only 19 states with Democratic controlled state legislatures, which means a likelyhood of needing 19 Trump states instead of 13.
2nd Amendment wasn't a big thing until the Supreme Court decided in Heller that the whole 'well-regulated militia' part was a nothingburger. Then the floodgates opened.
All you need is for another Supreme Court to put that part back in and restrict gun use to 'well-regulated militias.'
It's a lower bar than a constitutional amendment, but good luck putting the genie back in the bottle.
I've never heard a single politician propose banning guns. I've only ever heard Republican pundits SAY that Democrats want to take away your guns.
Sensible gun regulation can be enacted without banning all guns. It's only the extreme right that interprets the 2nd amendment as disallowing ANY regulations.
The right uses the 2nd amendment to cut off ANY discussion of gun reforms, and the eventual result COULD be that the 2nd amendment is eliminated using the methods you described, since it could be seen as the only way to enact sensible restrictions.
I don't want to lose the second amendment, do you? I'd rather see sensible regulations put in place while still largely retaining the right to bear arms. If those of us who are interested in gun ownership fight tooth-and-nail against ANY regulations, then it will make efforts to eliminate gun ownership entirely more likely to eventually succeed.
I'd prefer be part of the conversation to determine where the right line is on gun rights, rather than trying to cut off the conversation entirely by invoking the 2nd amendment.
You are correct, but it’s all about the interpretation of the law. Remember that the assault weapons ban, federal legislation on all the various tchotchkes, and the state laws on weapons and licenses have all been found constitutional. And while it won’t happen in this court, this court did establish the principle that they can reverse a decision that has historically guided laws and interpretations in this country for decades as being fundamentally flawed. The path to getting 50 votes in the senate to kill the filibuster, then expand the court with new appointees to turn the balance, then wait for the firearms cases to come in is easier than changing the constitution. I mean, we can’t even do that much at this point, but the math is easier.
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After an incident where an 11 year old boy was murdered, the governor of New Mexico banned open and concealed carry gun laws in New Mexico for 30 days. Right after the trauma. And just for 30 days. No one had to rip their heart out in public to be heard. The governor of New Mexico preemptively heard them and did something.
And you know what happened?
Everyone wedded to the availability of guns and their use came out to oppose it. As far as they're concerned, the leading cause of death for children can be firearms, firearms suicides can reach all-time highs, and the very population that seems to want guns around the most can kill themselves the most. It's all fine.
The magnitude of needless harm is inconsequential to just having a gun nearby. And they don't care if you, your whole family, or anyone dies because of it. They need their guns.
Non-American here.
Have you tried giving free guns to minorities? I seem to remember people suddenly change their minds on gun control when the Black Panthers armed themselves in California.
American here.
I'm all for minorities and other groups struggling for equality arming themselves. It is a lot harder for the government to stomp on your rights when they have to worry about you fighting back.
It wasn't that long ago the government used airplanes to bomb its own citizens...
Until America addresses it's police problem, which I propose stems from an ongoing inequality problem, the American public needs a way to defend itself.
Why do think minor drug possession is a felony and police over-patrol minority areas, they aim to make all minorities felons and keep them either in prison or unable to legally obtain firearms
The frustrating thing is the open carry ban would have had ZERO impact on that shooting:
"The young boy was shot and killed in a suspected road rage shooting last Wednesday near Isotopes Park. Police said someone in a Dodge Durango fired 17 shots at the car he was in when leaving the game, killing Froylan and wounding his 24-year-old cousin, Tatiana.
“The vehicle just pulled up on the side of them and started shooting,” Amaro said.
All of it happened with Froylan’s mother and baby brother in the back seat."
You could ban open carry, you could ban concealed carry, that would not have stopped that shooting.
There really isn't a way to know how it could have been prevented until we know who the shooter is.
Kind of pointless to pick a single particular time and argue that something would or would not have stopped it without any actual data.
If guns were less prevalent and harder to get would it cause there to be less gun fatalities?
If you are harder on people committing gun crimes would there be less gun fatalities?
If it were illegal to carry large amounts of amnition around with you, would there be less gun fatalities?
If it were illegal to carry around lots of weapons without being in a well-regulated militia, hence where police or other people would see you and go in that person's probably up to no good, would that cause there to be less gun fidelities?
Those statements have a lot more deciding power behind them whether they're right or wrong are you agree or disagree They actually mean something.
If some kid rolls up and does a school shooting do we hold their families responsible? You lived with that guy, prove reasonable doubt that you didn't see it happening and not report it.
But this one time it band camp crap doesn't prove or disprove anything it doesn't say anything about the general working of gun laws on population.
I would like an explanation from some of the people here touting the Second Amendment as an end-all and be-all to explain why it is that only in the past couple of decades has there been a huge gun proliferation. Shouldn't the amount of guns have stayed relative to the population if this is only about the Second Amendment?
It's not about whether or not it checks out logically for you. That's libtard thinking. It only matters that the 2A nuts get as many phallic objects in their possession as possible so you know that they do manly shit real good.
In my personal opinion, seems like a number of factors are at work. First, the second amendment has become more republican-coded, so republicans are probably more likely to purchase more guns than they would have. Second, the media's sensationalism has constantly increased, so a lot of people consider a gun to be a prudent option - either viewing many cities to be hellholes, and the only way they would travel there is with a CCW, or seeing crazy people fighting over COVID supplies and thinking "maybe they're coming for my toilet paper, better get a gun." Third, a lot of firearm-curious people see the rise of the republicans arming up and feel like they have no choice but to also get a gun.
One concerning element in all of this is that even though there has been an increase in guns, it doesn't seem like there has been a corresponding increase in gun ranges, so people are likely not achieving competence with their guns.
Im not saying 2a is perfect but when you have actions like we see from CA and NM politicians, it gives more fuel for the crazies to say "Look they are coming to take our guns" Also an extremely large majority of responsible gun owners agree that there needs to be more protections in place but are quickly turned off as soon as someone says certain firearms or accessories will be completely banned.
They’ve been told for years that the government is going to take their guns. The carnival barkers on talk radio or other right wing platforms continue to rant about government overreach taking their guns and how there’s criminals around every corner needing to be defended against.
In my opinion, it isn't even valid.
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State..."
Back then, a standing professional military was not expected. Militias were the expectation, be risen in times of need. This clearly is not true anymore, so the premise of the second amendment isn't true, which should invidate the rest, right?
I'm not anti-gun. I enjoy shooting them. I'm pro-regulation though. There should be requirements for training in their usage, proper storage and handling, and the legality of their use before anyone can purchase them. This should be funded by taxes to ensure poor people aren't less able to be armed than wealthier people.
I don't care HOW MANY kids have to die NO ONE is coming after my gun that I hang on my wall loaded and never use but when people come to my house I can pretend my penis is big! Fuck your kids! I need my penis enlarger!
Here's the trick... the Nashville shooter had no criminal record and bought the guns 100% legally. There is no gun restriction that would block someone who passes the background check from buying a gun.
BUT:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Nashville_school_shooting
"Hale was under care for an emotional disorder and had legally purchased seven firearms, including three recovered from the shooting scene, between October 2020 and June 2022.[1]"
If someone is under psychological care, should that be allowed to pop up on a background check? Maybe not as an instant disqualification the way a court ordered commitment or conviction would, but as an advisory note? Leave it to the discretion of the firearms seller? "By the way, this person is undergoing psych care, you could be held liable if they use this firearm in a crime." That kind of thing?
Because right now, the only stuff that shows up on the background check are things that were ruled on by a judge, and sometimes not even all of those.
For example:
The guy who shot up Michigan State University:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Michigan_State_University_shooting
"McRae was arrested in June 2019 for carrying a weapon without a concealed pistol license.[38] Initially charged with a felony, he pleaded guilty to misdemeanor unlawful possession of a loaded firearm as part of a plea agreement in November 2019.[39] He was originally sentenced to twelve months' probation, which was later extended to 18 months, and in May 2021, he was discharged from probation.[35] Because McRae was not convicted of a felony, his ban on possessing weapons ended with the end of his probation.[40]"
Arrested for a felony gun charge, pled out to a misdemeanor, did his time, did his probation, was allowed to buy guns again.
Had he been convicted of the felony, he would have been blocked from owning a gun. The misdemeanor was not a barrier and did not appear on the background check.
Maybe it should have? Maybe ANY gun charges, felony OR misdemeanor should bar you from gun ownership?
If you stigmatize psychological care by making it a black mark that shows up on your record, people will just avoid getting the help they need and society will be worse off for it.
Absolutely true.
So if we can't ban guns because of the 2nd amendment, and we can't report on psych care because that would drive people away from care, then what's the answer? 🤔 I don't see a way out of it unless you make mental health care and reporting mandatory.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
The parents who testified spilled their own stories, but also carried the weight of representing and speaking for the six people — including three children — who were killed by a shooter on March 27 inside The Covenant School.
Throughout the corridors of many state Capitols, families are sharing emotionally gutting stories of tragedy caused by mass school shootings with the hope that revealing their trauma will convince lawmakers from either party to reconsider firearm policies.
Lawmakers in Florida’s Republican-controlled Legislature passed a series of gun control laws just three weeks after authorities say a mentally disturbed man killed 17 people in a shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland.
The legislation raised the gun-buying age to 21, imposed a three-day waiting period for purchases and let police seek court orders seizing guns from individuals considered a danger to themselves or others — a stronger “red flag” change than a Tennessee proposal that couldn’t even get a hearing.
In April, Kimberly Mata-Rubio waited for more than 12 hours at the Texas Capitol to testify that lawmakers should raise the purchase age for semiautomatic rifles like the one an 18-year-old gunman used to kill her daughter Lexi.
During one committee hearing, parents closely connected to the Covenant shooting audibly gasped, and some fled the room in tears, when Republican Rep. Chris Todd suggested that the shooter “probably would have driven over those kids” if they didn’t have a gun, as a way to dismiss that fewer firearms — rather than more — would have prevented the tragedy.
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