Sometimes there is a better choice than Javascript

alert(“nyyeehh”);

furiously clicking non actionable button

Great, the programmer humor has inherited "JavaScript bad" from Reddit.

Wait, wait, don't confuse terms. I wouldn't want to hear the use of enshitification the same way people are wrongly using "gaslighting."

Yes, I agree with you on the sentiment. Sucks that the same bs posted on reddit is creeping into lemmy.

But the platform is the same. Lemmy is not adding ads, or removing api access or shit like that.
- Sucks that the same bs posted on reddit is creeping into lemmy
  
  I'm seeing this in a few communities and it's really frustrating. It's not surprising, because it's not like Lemmy has something built into the software to prevent it, it's just disappointing.
That's not a Reddit thing. That's just a thing.
And python was created to teach programming. And PHP was something a guy used to maintain his webpage. If a language is useful it will gain popularity, and I never used a language which I didn't find frustrating at some point.
- There are only two kinds of languages: the ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses.
  
  -- Bjarne Stroustrup
Yeah. I don't like writing JavaScript and I hate when I'm forced to use it to do something that could be handled otherwise except reasons. But especially with later versions it's not the worst thing in the world. I work in ruby on rails and love hotwire that lets me avoid js more than before. But still js isn't literally Hitler like people make it out to be
JavaScript is an abomination and real jobs don't use it
- I hate js, but are ya sure
- uh i use it every day at my very real job?
- Hey stop being sarcastic! This is a serious programing community here... Wait.
Things can be both bad and useful.
- whoa whoa whoa
  
  how can we have a flamewar if youre going to be all reasonable like that

Never heard of marquee or blink, eh?

And why did you feel the need to bring up those suppressed memories?

Wrong, annoying animations was Flash's thing. Javascript was made for annoying popups and alert boxes

Also for these animated status line texts that were supposed to show what's being loaded currently.

"Sometimes there is a better choice than JavaScript"

We call it TypeScript

I heard they're looking to add typing to JavaScript in a very similar style as TypeScript. Basically running TypeScript in the browser without tsc.

There's at least a proposal which I hope they'll continue with.

I was there for the first wave of SPAs, I even learned angularJs and Knockout. It did feel like a major atep forward, being able to make highly interactive applications. However, things quickly went off the rails when the tools stopped being about managing heavy client state, and became the default for everything, even when it ment using JavaScript to build extremely basic functionally browsers did natively with html, but extremely worse(e.g. navigation). The modern Web really is a victim of hype and trends.

Unless your app needs to work offline, or you have to manage dozens of constantly changing client side data points concurrently, your site doesn't need to be a big heavy js framework. My rule is if it looks like Google Maps, you need a SPA. if it looks like Gmail you need REST/HATEOS. and if it looks like google's mainpage, you need a server side rendering.

At some point you might see the light, and go back to making your websites simpler, but Im not hopeful. Until then I'm building the majority of things with HTMX and alpineJs.

I make fully static sites using react
- Yeah, I've personally been using react and vite-plugin-ssr to static render things and while there's been a few bumps it still feels pretty nice

Like typescript?

That's JavaScript with extra steps.

Say that to the madlad who wrote a virtual machine in js that can boot Linux and Windows: https://bellard.org/jslinux/

Something something he could, something he should

I thought that's what GIF was created for... Even if the original introduction of it is saying something completely different.

Doing Odin Project now and the constant shiting on JS online is sort of crushing my motivation. 😫

Don’t worry about, JS is a fine language and is used by all of the top companies. If you want to get a job as a software developer you have decent odds if you learn JS
- As someone currently job hunting - native JS isn’t enough anymore. Everyone wants React devs. I see some posts for Vue or Angilar and sometimes even TypeScript but the vast majority want React coders now.
If you don't hate a programming language you simply haven't used it enough or are delusional. Every language sucks in its own special way, js ain't special.
- cue “if those kids could read they’d be very upset”
- I agree with you that every language has its flaws but JS feels like it was a hodgepodge created without any design philosophy in mind. I don't use C or lisp in day to day work but I can appreciate their philosophies and power. Can't say the same about JS.
JS is fine. But as with any tool it's not the best for every scenario.

The flak JS tends to get us mostly because of the rise of popularity is Node.js leading to backend JavaScript beginning commonplace. which it's overall a poor choice for backend when compared to many other languages as the strengths that JS has are more tailored to frontend.
Don't let it get to you. This is mostly just a circlejerk by people who don't even use JS themselves.
Don't listen to the javascript haters.
Honest answer: JS is a shitty language and I despise it. BUT you can learn a ton of stuff with that, all the features (loops, conditions, variables, etc.) that exist in other languages. You will hate JS one day too, but right now it's good to learn, and when you'll switch to other languages, you'll be happy you learned something.

So yes, JS sucks, but no, it won't be useless for your future. Keep on working, programming is really fun.

css can do animations, and it's much more performant then js. I hate how over-used JavaScript is on "modern" websites.
some websites are even straight up unusable or don't display anything with js disabled....

Some websites, JavaScript is necessary for doing things without overloading a server. Mostly SPAs/PWAs and such. I’m using Voyager for Lemmy right now, which needs JS, but it gives me a great experience.

But yeah, JS is often overused. Luckily, with new technologies coming out like Astro and HTMX, we should hopefully start seeing less JavaScript on pages that don’t need it.
- Still wayting for a native solution to AJAX.
  
  No, not Java beans.
- htmx just generates js too

There is a better choice.

Huh, page displays nothing without js.
Just typescript at that point

Like, not creating annoying animations.

~~only~~ original

PHP dynamic sites, Ruby on Rails, or MVC in whatever language works for you is really what we should be doing