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There was something about that movie (uma Thurman) that no Batman movie after was able to do (it was uma Thurman). I haven't seen the movie in years, but I remember empathizing with the villains in a way that modern movies just don't want you to (it may have just been uma Thurman but I remember feeling bad for mr freeze too). I might just be queerer than other people but the level of camp felt genuine. I don't dislike other Batman movies, but that one felt fun to watch the way old comics were fun to read.
mr freeze and poison ivy are definitely the most sympathetic of the main cast of batman villains. as in, their motivations make more sense than like... calendar man.
I assume Calendar Man had a mental illness like OCD that manifested around dates due to the fact that his parents named him Julian Gregory Day.
And if someone has a mental illness in Gotham, you can bet a billionaire in S&M gear is there to beat the shit out of them.
I assume Calendar Man had a mental illness
Pretty much every batman villain is mentally ill in someway or another, and it's probably easier to list the ones that aren't. That's why they end up in Arkham "Asylum".
The ones that aren't mentally ill are disfigured. And at this point, you can probably count out the only ones left.
Ra's Al Ghul
Catwoman
Hush
Poison Ivy is like Magneto. It becomes harder and harder every year to say they're wrong.
Funnily enough, out of modern superhero movies, I think MCU got me to empathize with a villain the most. It was Thanos, who had a legitimate reason for reducing the population of the universe and didn't even want to discriminate.
I've grown bored with the MCU and haven't seen any of the newest films, but Infinity War was actually great.
Legitimate reason? Really?
That was the one thing that removed my ability to even try to suspend any disbelief in the fantasy. Like I couldn't even think of him as more than a one-dimensional caricature, let alone empathize with him. I was okay with Thanos just being some powerful guy seeking powerful objects to become more powerful. I might even sympathize, not empathize, with that. It was evil to be sure, but understandable. But, as soon as they revealed what he actually wanted to do with that power the whole thing just fell apart completely and became a total farce.
It was just bad logic that doesn't hold up to any scrutiny. Like why didn't he just double the resources? Why did he think the universe wouldn't just eventually return to pre-snap populations, because it's not like he also slowed population growth?
Population control is an ineffective solution to a nonexistent problem, but that thread of misanthropy, woven into the worldview of most who think #thanoswasright, is based on misinformation. Knowledge is the cure.
I don't know why the movies got the direction they did for his motivation but in the comics Thanos is trying to impress Death who he is in love with. It makes more sense than just getting rid of half the people for supposed resource scarcity.
Exactly. It's a nonsense motivation. What was he going to do? Come back every couple of decades and snap again?
Compare to Mass Effect's genophage. That's a plan. Horrible, but at least it makes sense.
The thing about Thanos though is that he is also a good example of what happens when a powerful figure is only surrounded by “yes” folks. Because his idea is, ultimately, stupid. Killing half of all life in the universe doesnʻt really change anything substantial because you wind up with the same problems: If you have 100 people and 50 cows or fruit trees or whatever, and you snap half of those, you still wind up with the same ratio. Now itʻs 50 people fighting for 25 cows or fruit trees or whatever.
The Infinity Stones basically make Thanos close to God. He could do anything. He could have doubled the resources of the universe, he could have created an entirely new form of resource.
In some ways this is in keeping with his characterization in the comics, where he has a habit of getting in his own way. But I kinda wish that Endgame, like in the Infinity Gauntlet series, would have revealed that he was actually trying to woo Death (which could have been represented by Hela) and so his supposed altruism is actually self-serving. Regardless, he does stand as a good representative of charismatic villains that garner sympathy while also being singularly focused on a really bad idea rooted in the villainʻs own self-assurance and ability to gather acolytes through a kind of “reality distortion field” effect.
They actually brought lady death into the canon with Agatha all along, played by April ludgate herself. I'd kill half the universe to impress April.
Thatʻs right! But at the time of Endgame, weʻd only seen Hela. I could definitely see someone snapping half the universe away for either of them lol.
I think my big issue with the MCU, is that they don't even try to make the flaws logical. Before the snap, thanos has all of the infinity stones and can bend reality. He could have done any other kind of random macguffin BS other than remove half of all people. If the avengers could look into the future and envision the one reality where they defeated Thanos, Thanos could've done the same but for whatever heuristic he was attempting to optimize. I know the villain in Black Panther gets a lot of hate for having an unsympathetic side just tacked on, but unfortunately it's quite historically accurate to have people pushing for some kind of enlightened revolution that haven't quite done all of the work to unlearn things themselves. I do think that the fact that he was written that way and isn't a real person is a valid argument as to why it's a poor defense, but it's suggested that MLK cheated on his wife and prominent figures in the Black Panther party did abuse women. So, I'm a bit torn on that, but between Thanos and whatever the hell was happening in falcon in the winter soldier, I still think the villains and the heroes could use some work.
Just to be clear, I don't think it takes away from the movies being great. I also really like infinity war, I just don't that I was on board with everyone's motivations all the time.
Edit: I responded to this comment from my inbox, and now I'm seeing that you already have replies saying that Thanos really isn't understandable. I wasn't trying to pile on, I just also believe that.
Hey, I agree that Thanos was stupid as hell. If he really wanted to save the universe, as an all powerful god at the point where he's got all the infinity stones, he could've done something about reproduction rates, or resources being regeneratable... I just meant he's the only one I've been able to empathize with recently. There's so many villains who just want power for the sake of it, or to end the world. Thanos wanted to do what he thought would save the world. Was it stupid? Sure. But his goal was not.