khaosworks @ khaosworks @startrek.website

Posts

103

Comments

250

Joined

2 yr. ago

Moderating

---

Oh, where do I start?

It’s a really, really tight script, for one, with little or no filler. Unlike TMP, it moves swiftly from scene to scene, from setup to setup, establishing its themes of mortality, aging, the inability to let go of the past, the tragedy and joy of moving forward, of rebirth right off the bat, in so subtle ways that most don’t catch it until later or a rewatch.

For fanservice, it makes good use of a loose end from TOS continuity which is simple enough for non-fans to get without much exposition, and memorable enough that old viewers will remember it. The relationship between the Big Three is no longer as broken as it was throughout most of TMP, and the banter naturalistic and enjoyable, even among the supporting crew.

Nick Meyer adds all these little touches in the background that make it ripe for literary analysis. A Tale of Two Cities and its themes of sacrifice, Kirk’s fondness for antiques, never really established before, echoing his nostalgia for times past. In Khan’s cargo carrier, you see on the shelf as Chekov discovers the SS Botany Bay tag: Dante’s Inferno, stacked on top of Milton’s Paradise Lost/Paradise Regained, stacked on top of Moby Dick, showing the progression of Khan’s experiences on Ceti Alpha V, echoing his hope in reference to Milton at the end of “Space Seed” - to rule in Hell, build his own Paradise - now replaced by obsessive revenge.

ST II also sets up TNG, in its way, by introducing Peter Preston, David Marcus and Saavik - essentially Scotty, Kirk and Spock’s offspring - the next generation of voyagers that the old guard are trying to give way to, but the past just won’t let them and indeed threatens that legacy.

And then of course there’s the space battles - never really as well executed due to SFX limitations in TOS - but yet leaning so completely into the nautical and submarine metaphor established by Roddenberry and “Balance of Terror”. It was a risky move in an era dominated by adrenaline-fueled Star Wars dogfight-like starship combat, but Meyers’ direction made it work. There’s never a time you don’t know exactly what’s going on in that battle, or what tactics the two sides are employing.

You’re right in the sense that it’s not traditionally what one expects of Star Trek, leaning more into the pulp adventure mold rather than the aliens and exploration mold. But to a degree it’s still an optimistic future. Kirk’s son and Spock’s daughter ready to take the reins, the Genesis Planet representing the potential for new life, Kirk himself experiencing a rebirth of sorts as he finds his youth restored as his best friends told him it would be - on the bridge of a starship. But who says the final frontier can’t be inside us, too? (Archer said as much)

And in the end, it’s a complete movie. The forced-on-Meyer shot of Spock’s torpedo casing notwithstanding, it’s a complete story from start to finish, with no “The Human Adventure Is Just Beginning” tease or the sequelitist tones of the next two movies. All the information you need to know is in here. You could watch it without tying it to a larger universe and be completely satisfied with the experience. All you really need to know beforehand is that it’s connected to this TV show from the 60s.

I try to always say, “I don’t know what it is, but it’s weird and pissed off,” when people ask me to identify something.

“Shuttle stuffed with torpedoes” wouldn’t work because it’d be obvious it was weaponized - a single shuttle likely couldn’t take out that beacon on its on.

At least the saucer section of the Caygua was big enough to provide plausibility. Even if they found pieces of the rockets later they’d have no real proof - the rockets could be claimed to have been standard equipment or part of the RCS or impulse systems.

Exhibit A: The Battle of Wolf 359.

While the name has been applied to the Christian God, since the term predates any connection with Abrahamic religions to China, I was sticking to the most fundamental use of the word - to refer to a supreme deity, as it was in the Shang Dynasty.

China has had more than one type of religion, even if some of them have been merged or mixed with each other, so to say it’s the supreme deity is also not precise. Shangdi has been used in Taoism as well as Confucianism, among others. Rather than get into a theological history, I was just compressing it into as general a term as possible.

Your usage is not entirely incorrect, but it implies that there is only one supreme deity in China, which is not quite precise either.

I was just trying to answer the technological criticisms about why Spock didn’t search.

I see where the criticism is coming from, but I can also see there are all sorts of extenuating circumstances around it (not to mention lack of time) and to take the plot there for a search would kind of kill the story momentum.

It’s not invalid as a criticism, just saying that tech reasons are covered.

True, but that’s on the ground and short range. There’s specific dialogue to show that it’s interfering with signals between space and ground.

SPOCK: I detect a counter-frequency emanating from the planet. It appears to be negating all scans, communications, and transporter signals between here and there.

Spock can’t even scan for life signs on Cayuga. The best they have is passive sensors like spectrometry.

UNA: Still trying to scan for life signs?

SPOCK: I theorized I might be able to find a frequency gap through the interference field, but I have not managed to discover one yet.

UNA: Spock, I don't think anyone's alive over there.

SPOCK: Spectrometric analysis suggests there are still pockets of oxygen on board. It is possible someone could have survived.

That’s why they had to do a visual confirmation and discovered Cayuga’s sickbay had been blown away.

Isn’t the point though that the Gorn interference field was preventing any scans, comms or transport? The tricorder wouldn’t have worked there. And sending rescue teams would have been dangerous given Gorn belligerence, demarcation line or not.

You do realize that without shields, they’d have been blown out of the sky in one shot rather than being able to survive in a firefight, right? It’s like saying what’s the point of a kevlar vest if I’m going to get a broken rib from a body shot? If I can live, I’ll take that vest and broken rib, thanks.

Power is relative. There’ve been times we’ve seen weapons from less advanced species than the Federation bounce uselessly off shields or are seen as no threat. We’ve also seen Starfleet ships get carved up like a prize turkey. The Gorn are powerful, that’s just it. That doesn’t mean Starfleet aren’t heavy hitters - at this point it’s just that there’s a stronger kid in the playground.

Exhibit A would be the Pike that we see in SNW: “Among the Lotus Eaters” who damn nearly killed Zac Nguyen while a blank slate, before his memories and restraint were restored.

So yes, that Pike from 5 years ago is still under there. He grew as a person.

The question was mostly rhetorical :) But yes, I agree that Scotty’s more chaotic bypassed-like-a-Christmas-tree style wouldn’t sit well with Pelia, as evidenced by her reaction to his improvised Gorn transponder: “The hell is this supposed to be?”

Thanks for reminding me!

Thanks!

Thanks! First thing I noticed…

It may be a while, depending on when they settle the SAG-AFTRA/WGA strike.

As to how they'll resolve the cliffhanger, it's probably going to be Scotty's Gorn transponder that will confuse the Gorn ships long enough for Enterprise to get in close and somehow beam the abductees back.

Yes, I noted that in the c/startrek reaction thread, and how the Paisley accent is less harsh than ones from Glasgow.

As I note in my annotations, I got very emotional whenever I heard them refer to Scotty as “Mr Scott”. Not sure why, it just sounded so right. When they said, “Thank you, Mr Scott,” I mentally added: “That’s something he’s going to get used to hearing over the years.”

The moment I heard Pike say he missed Batel and then praise Ortegas I immediately knew they were going to be placed in jeopardy and sure enough…

It was also immediately obvious when the Gorn youngling left Batel alone why it did so, so glad they didn’t string that out as some big mystery.

The colony design meant that filming exteriors was cheaper, I suppose. It’s the equivalent of building a gated community as a Ren Faire, though there’d definitely be a demand for it.

Wish they’d have given some hints to why that Gorn was on the Cayuga saucer, though. Why was it trying to access command level functions? Intel or something else? And how did it get there without Enterprise noticing or was it there before they arrived? Questions, questions…

At least Martin Quinn, who plays Scotty, is a Paisley boy like David Tennant and Steven Moffat, which means using his natural accent will be easier to make out, as the Paisley accent is less harsh than, say, a Glaswegian one. He’s a bit young for Scotty though, at 28. I’d always assumed Scotty was at least five to ten years older than Kirk.

Nice, fast moving action finale - but I echo the frustration at having this be a cliffhanger.

Annotations up at: https://startrek.website/post/777051

It’s not a coincidence, it’s Pike. Pike’s seen the future and knows the Romulans are coming, and he also knows that Kirk being in command of Enterprise at that point has the best chance of succeeding at staving off the new war the Romulans will want to provoke in TOS: “Balance of Terror”.

He can’t tell Kirk that, of course, and he can’t do anything active to make it seem he’s planning for Kirk to take over. But what he can do is that if an opportunity comes to let Kirk aboard and become familiar with the Enterprise, her crew, and bond with them, he’ll take it. A joint mission with the Farragut and Kirk wants to visit? Sure. XO training with Una? Why not? Work closely with senior staff? By all means.

Eventually Kirk will be Pike’s explicit choice to succeed him, and at that point Kirk will have both the experience he needs and a familiarity and relationship with the crew and ship that will make him a plausible one.