[REPOST] Won't Let Me Go To Jury Duty? Enjoy Being Questioned In Court
[REPOST] Won't Let Me Go To Jury Duty? Enjoy Being Questioned In Court
[REPOST]
This was back in the '80s, my first job, working as a maintenance man at a local hotel. I'd been working there part-time since I was 16 and when I turned 18, I got a notice to attend jury duty. I picked a week and I let my boss know.
The owner of the hotel found out and sees me in the hallway and tells me that I need to do "whatever it takes" to get out of jury duty because he needs me at the hotel that week for a large dog show, and if I'm not at work, I'm fired.
When I get to jury duty, day 1, I get selected for a week-long trial, and the judge asks jurors if there's any reason we cannot serve on the jury. They go around... When they get to me, I'm nervous, never been in court before and too scared to lie.
Cue malicious compliance.
I tell the judge that the owner of the business I work at will fire me if I'm not back today and said I needed to do everything I can to get out of jury duty or I'm fired, other than that I'm fine serving. The judge looks p*ssed.
The judge has me approach the bench, asks for the name of the owner, location, etc. Then he hands the court officer a paper and says something to the officer. I'm told to return to the jury box. About an hour later (still selecting a jury), the officer returns with the owner, visibly shaken, in handcuffs and walked to the front of the judge's bench.
The owner is standing in front of the judge. The judge asks him questions which he apologetically tries to worm out of.
Then the judge instructs him that I will be here for jury duty, I will serve as long as I need to, and he should NOT do anything to retaliate against me -- and that the judge is filing charges and will be instructing the clerk to check with me regularly and if, for any reason, I am fired or face any disciplinary action at work - he will hold the owner in contempt, violation of a court order, and a bunch more legal stuff. He will spend time in jail thinking about how important jury duty is.
Then the judge makes him apologize to me, in court!
I made it onto the jury and I served the week. I reported back to work the following week. I expected some blowback, but I never got fired, none of my shifts were changed and I got paid for my time in jury - I didn't ask why I got paid.
The clerk did check back a few times and I was told to call the judge's clerk's direct phone number if anything happened. It was awesome, I was pretty much bullet-proof and worked until I saved enough to go back to school.
TL;DR: When I got my first notice for jury duty, my boss told me to get out of it or I'd be fired. Being the scared 18-year old that I was, when the judge asked if any of us couldn't serve, I told him what my boss had said. The judge had my boss dragged into court and threatened with jail time. I ended up serving on the jury and getting paid for the days I missed at work.
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That is awesome. I don’t get why people don’t want to serve on juries anyway? It’s a civic duty and it will probably be only once in your life. It’s an interesting experience!
You often don't get paid or don't get paid nearly enough. Too many people like paycheque to paycheque to be able to do that.
And in extreme cases, you can get sequestered, where you're expected to basically put your life on hold for the duration of the trial, which complete bullshit and feels as if you're being punished.
Sequestering is absolutely not bullshit. It's done for very important reasons and judges are very careful about not ordering it unless it's truly necessary.
Yeah I've been called for jury duty twice and both times I didn't respond and didn't show up and nothing has ever happened to me.
I'm not familiar with the laws but the way I understood it wouldn't have been paid and I need my paycheck.
You'd better hope you never get pulled over for a ticket or any other reason that a cop would have to pull your record because you almost certainly have bench warrants out for your arrest.
Land of the fuckin free, amirite?
It is interesting, but it's also frustrating, and forced, effectively uncompensated work. I say 'effectively' uncompensated because they pay you a token amount that may have been adequate 100 years ago but now is not. Indeed, many people wind up making negative money when taking in the cost of travel and food, to say nothing of actual missed pay from their normal job.
That said it is actually kind of easy to get out of it if you really want to most of the time. When I served, the judge accepted any reasonable excuse from those who needed to leave. The most annoying part though was that it felt like the attorneys liked wasting time on irrelevant bullshit.
Additionally, when the judge asks if there's any reason you can't serve you can state you will never vote against your conscience regardless of the law, and that if you don't believe a person should be punished you will not vote them guilty no matter what the law says. They do not want and will not take someone who votes their conscience above all else.
Unfortunately, the easiest way to get out of jury duty is to be a scientist, engineer, or lawyer. No attorney with half a brain wants anyone of those three professions to be on a jury deciding the fate of their client.
Well, my neuroscience professor told us the story where he served on a jury that related to brain injury. He thought it was odd they didn't have a problem with him.
As an aside, the defendant's expert witness explained some findings of 2 men, Santiago Ramón and Cajal. He then questioned to himself how much of an expert the witness was if he didn't know that Santiago Ramón y Cajal was the name of a single man.
Can you get in trouble for telling a judge that you do not believe that the court is inherently ethical and that you will only vote on the basis of your personal set of ethics?
See the courts upholding: slavery, the criminalization of certain people marrying, the infringement of other people's rights, etc... Repeatedly throughout US history.
You can also just say you understand the concept of "jury nullification" and that will get the prosecutor and judge wanting you out ASAP.
If you truly believe in jury nullification, you won't mention it to the judge or prosecutor though...
"Believe in"? It's not a figment.
I’ll forever be annoyed at myself for a reply that got me out of jury duty.
I do understand the importance of the concept and I am willing to serve. My only objection so far is how wasteful it can be. I got called up several years in a row …. To miss work and sit in a dingy basement all day until being excused as “not needed”. I even understand the point that the court has to be ready, but there’s got to be a way to make it less inconvenient to “stand by”.
So the one time my jury duty might have turned into doing something useful for society in return for my inconvenience , I get called to the bench and was asked a few questions. Unfortunately I got hit with anxiety and babbled something that I recognized afterwards as the exact opposite as intended, and was immediately excused.
Edit: fine, I’ll say it. The people who would use it to get out of jury duty probably wouldn’t take their responsibility seriously anyway. I attempted to say something like “I hold the police to a higher standard as a witness since that is their job”, and it came out as “yes, I always believe the police”. Wtf?
Once in my life? Please, I'm coming on to my third jury duty, 3 times too many if you ask me to basically not get paid for however long it is.
and it will probably be only once in your life.
Said like a suburbanite.
The structure of USA's society is that everyone travels to cities to work (where the office and/or restaurants / hangout spots are), but then travels to suburbia to sleep / pay taxes.
This means that the cityfolk are constantly doing jury duty for all the suburbanite visitors. Someone who lives in an urban area is pretty much going to get selected for jury duty as often as legally allowed.
Comes with the territory, like complaining about how expensive urban areas are. No one is forcing most people to live in or near a big city. You weren't forced to take a job that requires it.
I hate the suburbs too, they can't subsidize themselves though taxes for example, but this seems more like a matter of choice.
I live in the suburbs, because I recognize that I get all the benefits of cities with almost none of the downsides. Don't hate the player, hate the game. As long as I can afford the suburbia and as long as it leads to a better life, I'll take advantage of it.
But in the vast majority of cases, its the cities that provide the value (IE: job creation, center of commerce and innovation, location of efficiency with public transit / steamworks / useful infrastructure)... while suburbs are basically trying to live as close to the city as possible without taking on the responsibilities (IE: taxes go to the suburb schools / suburb cops without paying into the city that makes the suburb livable)
Jury Duty is just one more thing that proves the pattern. People mostly don't commit crimes in suburbia, because no one is doing commerce in suburbia (its more efficient to centralize commerce into the city). So when crimes are committed, they're usually in the city (white-collar, suing, traffic crimes, etc. etc.). So the overworked city-justice system (already at a disadvantage due to higher crime due to being the center of commerce) is then overworked some more as they usually can't recruit jurors.
Doubly-so for cities like New York City who are supporting the suburbs in New Jersey. New York City cannot cross state lines and grab jurors from New Jersey, even though we all damn well know that New Jersey residents constitute a huge portion of the traffic, commerce, crime, and other problems in NYC.
Less so for cities closer to the center of a state... especially if the State can better distribute jurors / taxes and have a more fair system.
I was called to jury duty in Arkansas back in '17. I actually WANTED to participate, but sadly, my spouse wanted to move out of state. When doing the initial court appearance, it was explained that if we received a ticket for parking within x blocks, bring the ticket to the court, and they would solve it. Sure enough, I had a ticket. I took it to the court, and I never heard anything more about it. When I moved, I still had 5 months of eligibility. I called they court, explained my move, and that was it.
We live in this country and gain all the benefits, so we should expect (and WANT) to perform our civic duty.
I've been on a jury a couple of times myself. The first time was boring and was a frustrating case. The second time was disturbing but very interesting and definitely a satisfying experience.
I understand that not everyone wants to serve if their employer doesn't pay them; it can be a burden. Luckily mine does so I always look forward to summons in the hopes I get on a jury now.
Because people can't afford to. Most employers won't pay you during that time. The court pays you like $15 a day which probably doesn't cover your parking and lunch.
Depending how long you have to serve you can lose out on hundreds or thousands of dollars.
Most of America is living paycheck to paycheck. So being summoned is basically a death sentence for a lot of people.