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It's a reminder of what he went through to atone for the sins of mankind
The point is that he doesn't like crosses
That part never made any sense to me either. Why do sins need to be forgiven and how does torturing someone allow forgiveness? Seems like torturing and killing the son of god would be a serious sin by itself.
Couldn't god just realize he created flawed beings and forgive them himself, or not hold a grudge about it? Humans are how he made them according to the religion.
You ask good questions, but if you're really interested you can look into Christian apologetics re: free will. There are some interesting answers awaiting you. But the gist of it is that God didn't create flawed beings, he created beings with free will that chose to be flawed.
And Christianity has never said free will is a flawed design, because humans having free will is one of the most important aspects of the religion and is very fundamental to what it means to be a human (a concept that is true both in and outside of Christianity, unless you believe in destiny or something). It is not a flaw to have free will, otherwise God himself would be flawed. In a regular context, it's kind of like you're not flawed for existing, but you're flawed if you do negative things with your existence. I would personally have to be convinced that having free will is a flaw/a negative thing
To quickly answer your first couple questions: death is the punishment for sinning and Jesus is supposed to be perfect and sinless and thus should not die. but instead he died in place of other sinners, kind of like taking the blame for them. And yes, torturing and killing the son of God was indeed a sin, the people who did it were sinful. I don't think anyone has said otherwise. The ones who killed Jesus were not his followers or supporters
death-cultsplainin'
Copium
That, too.
Yes sir whatever you say great discussion
i'm giving you free will now i'm punishing you for making the choice i didn't like
but seriously, i do appreciate your well-written comment - it's just that it all gets very tiresome. i have been listening to/reading the apologetics and arguments, getting invited, prayed and ranted at. i have been nodding my head politely, smiling awkwardly, and dodging questions for a great many years, when really i just want to do my own thing and be left in peace with it (without words like "sinner" and "evil" getting tossed around).
anyway, that's just my experience.
I mean, even in a society you have free will and get punished for not confirming to it? Do you think societies as a whole with laws and rules are tiresome and you don't want words like "criminal" tossed around? Are you going to just leave society and not live in community with others?
You can do your own thing for sure. But everyone, even people who believe and are Christian, are sinners. Literally everyone is a sinner. You can still be at peace with your own thing anyway, even in a religious context. Christians find peace while admitting to being sinners. I'm not saying you need to, you're totally free to do your own thing. I'm just explaining things really
i think i was too subtle in my statement.
let me put it this way - it seemed to me that you were interested in explaining your perspective, as if simply offering information to contribute to a greater understanding. when someone expressed their disinterest in your explanation or indicated they did not find it sufficient, it seemed to me as if you were quickly negative. i was left with the impression that you are fundamentally less interested in dialogue and understanding, and more interested in convincing.
this is very typical of conversation with christians in a my 40+ year experience as a non-christian living in the bible belt. i tire of the efforts to explain christianity, when i have, in fact, heard it so extensively for so long. i tire of the conversations that are not REALLY intended to explain, but to solicit agreement and convert.
in other words - i wish more christians recognized that it may not be that non-christians don't understand your faith, they may simply not agree and not want to hear about it again. and approaching them as if you are interested in dialogue when you really want to convince them feels disingenuous.
these were my thoughts when i read your conversation with the other user above.
I don't know what part of "death-cultsplainin'" and me replying with "copium" makes you think there was a "conversation" going on
Let me explain my thoughts. I have taken time to write up something for someone else and someone- an unrelated party, barges in and pretty rudely replies with no intention to say anything, just to write a snide one word comment as if it's supposed to be anything other than a disrespectful comment.
Does it seem like when I said "thanks for contributing nothing to our discussion" I was trying to convert someone? I don't know where you got that idea. I was expressing that one word replies aren't good conversation at all. It's just annoying. My thoughts here are that it's pretty rude to come into a conversation just to go "haha cultist". I think people who look down on religion need to stop finding every opportunity to disrespect and be condescending to others who are invested in the topic.
Someone asked questions and I was just answering them. And for some reason you think I am in the wrong here when someone is clearly replying to me without an interest in actually talking to me. You know that person could have easily said nothing. If someone "may not want to hear it again" there are numerous solutions to this: close the thread, collapse the comment, reply with "sorry I really don't like this". Snarkily replying with "cultist" is not one of them. It's just rude and disrespectful. Maybe you guys should stop conflating disrespect with actual expression of disinterest, because it's not.
In no circumstance do I find one word snarky replies a sufficient or respectful way to reply to someone engaging in an actual discussion. Like ever. Religious discussion context or not, it's just a terrible reply. Idk why you think me replying with "yes whatever you want" is somehow me trying to convince him into a religion, like what. You are projecting and inserting things into this situation that are not there
Seems he could have anticipated the flaw.
Seems you could have read my comment better
The doylist explanation is that a lot of religions back in the day practiced animal sacrifice to their deities (including judaism, e.g. Noah sacrificing animals after the flood and Abraham sacrificing a ram in place of his son once god was bored of telling Abraham to kill his kid to prove his faith). Jesus getting sacrificed is supposed to be a mirror of this for Christians and an "ultimate" sacrifice. They don't sacrifice animals to god anymore because jesus just keeps doing the heavy lifting for them.
He's afraid of crosses, like vampires...wait a minute... Doesn't like crosses. Rose from the dead. Wants people to drink his blood.
Does he also sparkle in sunlight?
He is also hunted by Blade
Ah - so they think if they aren't wearing the cross he'll have forgotten about the whole crucifixion thing?
I mean, to be fair he was only up there for like half a day - so short they allegedly needed to poke him given how unusual dying that quickly was for the execution method (though it was suspiciously shortly after drinking something in two accounts).
So yeah, maybe they have a point and a reminder is warranted.
"Hey you, remember that they nailed you to a cross! Don't forget! The most important thing in your life was that. You said some other stuff that I don't really remember and usually zone out about on Sundays, but for sure the whole getting nailed to wood part was really really important and the ultimate summation of your life's purpose. It was somehow necessary because I like to look at boobs on the Internet. So thanks for that, and again - don't forget about it, because I'm sure it was very forgettable."
No no no no, you have it backwards. They're not trying to remind Jesus of the cross, they're trying to remind themselves just how painful of a death that the alleged Redeemer of man had to go through.