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[DISCUSSION] [SPOILERS] Ironheart - S01E06

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  • The ending of this is bad. I don't know why they did that. I really want to see Ironheart eventually become an actual superhero, but I don't know what is going to happen to her now.

    She never actually became a superhero. She never actually developed a sense of justice or a desire to do good. She never actually took to helping anyone besides her self. And then at the end, she just makes a deal with a demon to resurrect her best friend? For an origin story, this felt more like a retirement. She has no public persona or identity or motivating purpose or network. At least Kate Bishop met an Avenger and declared an intent to fight crime. But what kind of future adventures are we expecting to get with Ironheart, either solo or in an ensemble? It was a superhero origin story where no superhero originated. And it's made worse by my concerns that we'll even see this character in another show or movie. Is this just her whole arc? Is Ironheart in the MCU done now?

    What a bummer. I really hope they correct course. Make this a dream or something. I want real Ironheart.

    • I completely disagree. I also want to see her become a superhero, but what I saw here was a real person with "low stakes" problems.

      She wanted her friend back. That's a relatable problem. Now... She makes a deal with the devil to do that, but I get it. I don't think she's being set up as a villain. She didn't do anything villainous. She did some bad things, but I don't think she is a villain.

      She is a hero who hasn't figured out her way.

      Think of Spider-Man during Homecoming. Now Spider-Man has the benefit of Iron Man, but think about if he didn't. He tracked down the bad guys to a ship, that ship got cut in half and... it's a complete disaster. Spider-Man got lucky.

      Now think of Spider-Man in Far From Home. He hands EDITH to Mysterio. He gets help from "Nick Fury" & "Maria Hill". He barely saves the day and at the cost of his identity being revealed.

      Now think of Spider-Man in No Way Home. He nearly kills, arguably attempts to murder, the Green Goblin. Only a multiversal version of him is able to stop him.

      Riri doesn't have that. That's her story. Sure she has family, but they don't know what to do, they don't know how to help. Riri is willing to take on more risk.

      You have to learn to be a hero. To learn you need help. Riri will get there, but she has to make A LOT of mistakes along the way.

      In terms of her future, I hope it is a Young Avengers type movie. I want her alongside these other people. I want her to learn and grow to make the "correct" decisions. But it isn't going to be free. She's made some bad choices, but that's ok. She can learn, she can grow.

      • I feel like the important distinction between this and all those Spider-Man examples is that all those Spider-Man examples take place in the context of Spider-Man being a superhero. He's a guy who shows up to save people.

        I'm fine with a story of a hero failing it succumbing to temptation. But a better analogy would be if in Raimi's Spider-Man, Uncle Ben never died and Peter just direct the rest of the movie using his new powers trying to buy a car to impress MJ.

        • Maybe a better way to look at it is Tony Stark then.

          Prior to the events of the Iron Man film his guide was Obadiah Stane. The Stark company leaned heavily into weapons manufacturing. For Peter Parker it is more chasing Tony, so he does lean more heroic as a starting point. But for Tony, he has to learn from his own mistakes. Obviously Riri is ALSO chasing Tony, but goes about it differently and ends up in a different situation.

          I dunno, for me it works.

    • It seems to me like they are setting her up to be a villain. Like, she's an anti-hero in this, but literally every character in this show gets away with doing bad stuff. No consequences. So I expect we'll see Riri, Joe, Mephisto, Parker again and all of them will be in a villainous role (maybe Joe not?). Riri could be the antagonist for Billy or even a teased Strange Academy show featuring America Chavez.

      • That seems far fetched, but who knows. I think that would be very misguided.

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